Posted Jul 16, 2008 at 11:20PM by Mabie A.
Listed in:
Interviews,
News,
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Tags:
Microsoft,
Square Enix,
Tetsuya Nomura,
SYNC
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 The Final Fantasy drama is definitely far from over. With fans now over the shock (done with the denial stage), and most probably in the angry phase, the producers of the popular Square Enix franchise is now talking about the much-talked about Xbox 360 version.Shinji Hashimoto and Yoshinori Kitase, in an interview with 1Up, has revealed that although FFXIII will also be developed for Microsoft's console, this does not in any way mean that the PS3 version will be affected, simply because this will be finished first. And while admitting that a simultaneous launch will definitely be no walk in the park, they say that they're "definitely trying to decrease the gap between the Japanese launch and when we release it to the rest of the world." But the juicy part is when they were asked if there had been any negative reaction from Japanese Xbox 360 owners about the FFXIII announcement since (quoting the interview question) "It's not coming out on 360 there, and Japanese gamers won't be able to play the U.S. import on their systems, since the console's region-locked. To this they replied: "There doesn't seem to be any overly negative feedback yet, as Japanese users have known since the beginning that it's coming to PS3. " But what's even more interesting and juicy in this interview was their hinted "big announcement" pertaining to FFVII in the coming weeks. This is in response to a query on updates regarding Tetsuya Nomura's adding of new scenes to the FFVII: Advent Children Complete Blu-ray release. You can look forward to the upcoming invite-only fan event DKS3713 [taking place in Tokyo on August 2 and 3], where we'll have a major announcement that will shock the fans in attendance. Another shocking announcement?!? Really now, after the Xbox 360 bomb that dropped on us a couple of days ago, we now know anything is possible with them. This comes in complete sync with what Nomura himself has revealed last week, although at that time, it seemed like they weren't sure yet whether to announce it at E3 or wait for a later date. We now know the answer to that bit. Anyhow, we guess we'll just have to wait and brace ourselves for this next wave of surprises, then. The coproducers also opened up about other tidbits on the franchise, such as character development for Lightning, the game's heroine, updates on the mobile title Final Fantasy Agito XIII, as well as pressure from meeting fans' expectations of a long-running, highly successful franchise. To read the full interview, follow the source below. Related Articles:
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by Donciclon - 2008-07-16 |
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» Guys lower ur hopes for FF7, they don't give a sh?t about fans
I really don't care what they're next announcement is...judging from their interview after E3 and how it's all about money...this surprise is probably just another jerk to the stiffy they gave micro$oft.
I really don't care what they're next announcement is...judging from their interview after E3 and how it's all about money...this surprise is probably just another jerk to the stiffy they gave micro$oft.
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Re: skidz - 2008-07-17 |
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» Gaming industry + all about money
Very few companies these days are about anything but the money.
Very few companies these days are about anything but the money.
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Re: raggedjimmi - 2008-07-17 |
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» -
OR, Square might have approached Microsoft about this since... Well the PS3 install base isn't exactly giant, now is it?
And WTF. You people act so shocked but they did the same thing to Nintendo years ago. Square go where the money is. This is why they're putting more effort and more games onto the DS over the PSP. This is why that new DQ game is heading to the DS.
Why would Square limit themselves to the smallest install market? To satisfy some moronic fans who believe in "tradition"? Tradition which some seem to think started on Sony consoles...
OR, Square might have approached Microsoft about this since... Well the PS3 install base isn't exactly giant, now is it?
And WTF. You people act so shocked but they did the same thing to Nintendo years ago. Square go where the money is. This is why they're putting more effort and more games onto the DS over the PSP. This is why that new DQ game is heading to the DS.
Why would Square limit themselves to the smallest install market? To satisfy some moronic fans who believe in "tradition"? Tradition which some seem to think started on Sony consoles...
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Re: rollypoly - 2008-07-17 |
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» raggedjimmi
couldn't agree more
it was never about tradition, the only reason sony has had a lock on FF titles since 7 is it's large market and capable hardware.
they aren't the only big system in town anymore...
couldn't agree more
it was never about tradition, the only reason sony has had a lock on FF titles since 7 is it's large market and capable hardware.
they aren't the only big system in town anymore...
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Re: Donciclon - 2008-07-17 |
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» yea
@ragge - i wasn't really surprised...i just don't like people changing their mind last minute. It was announced as a ps3 exclusive for the better part of 2 years. I wondered then why because i knew it was all about the money.
but like i said i really don't care...i grew out of the fanboy thing a while ago (SONY club). I'm satisfied with my PS3 purchase, and i'm the type of gamer that gets hooked on one good release that holds me off for months at a time (i.e. Call of duty, Socom, the occasional RPG, and the now the mentioned M.A.G. sounds interesting). And its not below me to buy a 360 for that one killer app which might just be gears2 (i'll just have to wait and see)
@ragge - i wasn't really surprised...i just don't like people changing their mind last minute. It was announced as a ps3 exclusive for the better part of 2 years. I wondered then why because i knew it was all about the money.
but like i said i really don't care...i grew out of the fanboy thing a while ago (SONY club). I'm satisfied with my PS3 purchase, and i'm the type of gamer that gets hooked on one good release that holds me off for months at a time (i.e. Call of duty, Socom, the occasional RPG, and the now the mentioned M.A.G. sounds interesting). And its not below me to buy a 360 for that one killer app which might just be gears2 (i'll just have to wait and see)
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Re: sony_player - 2008-07-17 |
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» ragged
It is a big deal, because unlike the others, sony owns stock in SE. They own nearly 10% which may not seem like a lot, but it's a lot more than microsoft or nintendo own. So yeah, SE should be more loyal to Sony
It is a big deal, because unlike the others, sony owns stock in SE. They own nearly 10% which may not seem like a lot, but it's a lot more than microsoft or nintendo own. So yeah, SE should be more loyal to Sony
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by Powerslave89 - 2008-07-17 |
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» My Opinion On The Issues
On The FFXIII Issue It's All GOOD Bigger Fanbase For The Game Not FOR A SYSTEM (I OWN ALL 3 SYSTEMS And Both Portables SO U CANT CALL ME A FANBOY OVER A SYSTEM)
On The FFVII Issue I Think It May Be The Game That Takes Place After Dirge.
"""""""SPOILER"""""""""SPOILER"""""""""SPOILER""""""""""" Does Anyone Remember Genesis Being Revived Magically At The End Caring Whats His Name In The End? It's Kinda Like He's The Main Bad Guy Thats Working Behind The Scene Like Wesker In Resident Evil. Who Knows What Does Everyone Think???
It May Also Be The Remake That Everyone Desires So Badly But I Really Dont Think So Since Most Of The Main Staff Are Still Held Up with Other Projects Like FFXIII And Versus.
On The FFXIII Issue It's All GOOD Bigger Fanbase For The Game Not FOR A SYSTEM (I OWN ALL 3 SYSTEMS And Both Portables SO U CANT CALL ME A FANBOY OVER A SYSTEM)
On The FFVII Issue I Think It May Be The Game That Takes Place After Dirge.
"""""""SPOILER"""""""""SPOILER"""""""""SPOILER""""""""""" Does Anyone Remember Genesis Being Revived Magically At The End Caring Whats His Name In The End? It's Kinda Like He's The Main Bad Guy Thats Working Behind The Scene Like Wesker In Resident Evil. Who Knows What Does Everyone Think???
It May Also Be The Remake That Everyone Desires So Badly But I Really Dont Think So Since Most Of The Main Staff Are Still Held Up with Other Projects Like FFXIII And Versus.
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Re: Beatnutz - 2008-07-17 |
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» """""""SPOILER"""""""""
You write like a three year old. Go back to school.
You write like a three year old. Go back to school.
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Re: death - 2008-07-17 |
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» Hey How Do You Make
Every First Letter Caps ............. Better Yet Why?
Every First Letter Caps ............. Better Yet Why?
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Re: Powerslave89 - 2008-07-17 |
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» FANBOY
I Ask For An Opinion And I Get An Insult. Who Should Go Back To School?
Anyways What Does Everyone Else Think?
I Ask For An Opinion And I Get An Insult. Who Should Go Back To School?
Anyways What Does Everyone Else Think?
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Re: StainlessSteve - 2008-07-17 |
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» Actually...
There is no S in anyway. It's not anyways. But really, there is no reason for every single word to be capitalized.
There is no S in anyway. It's not anyways. But really, there is no reason for every single word to be capitalized.
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by Apeaggedon - 2008-07-17 |
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» maybe ...
just maybe it could be an anouncment of the ffvII remake.
hopefully it wont be "it brings me great pleasure today,to anounce that we at square-enix have decided to remake ff7 on the ps3....... oh and on the 360 as well,sry but its our tradition to f**k sony in the azz while sucking m$ 8IID"
IMO i have appsolutley no idea wut they will anounce,but after that backstabbing bull they pulled at the m$ e3 concert,i refuse to get hyped over anything sqeenix has to do with anymore.
i accually want it to be KINGDOM HEARTS EXCLUSIVELY TO THE PS3 :)
just maybe it could be an anouncment of the ffvII remake.
hopefully it wont be "it brings me great pleasure today,to anounce that we at square-enix have decided to remake ff7 on the ps3....... oh and on the 360 as well,sry but its our tradition to f**k sony in the azz while sucking m$ 8IID"
IMO i have appsolutley no idea wut they will anounce,but after that backstabbing bull they pulled at the m$ e3 concert,i refuse to get hyped over anything sqeenix has to do with anymore.
i accually want it to be KINGDOM HEARTS EXCLUSIVELY TO THE PS3 :)
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Re: Games4James - 2008-07-17 |
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» Backstabbing?
So announcing FFXIII for the 360 is backstabbing? LOL! Some of you so-called gamers, no-one the general media looks down on gamers so such. :D
So announcing FFXIII for the 360 is backstabbing? LOL! Some of you so-called gamers, no-one the general media looks down on gamers so such. :D
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Re: Games4James - 2008-07-17 |
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» Oops, spell check...
should read... "no wonder the general media looks down on gamers so much".
Which is true.
But seriously, what's your problem Apeaggedon? It's not as if they've cancelled the PS3 version! You act as if Sqaure Enix owes you something. :) They have to make money, like everyone else, so a 360 version makes perfect sense.
should read... "no wonder the general media looks down on gamers so much".
Which is true.
But seriously, what's your problem Apeaggedon? It's not as if they've cancelled the PS3 version! You act as if Sqaure Enix owes you something. :) They have to make money, like everyone else, so a 360 version makes perfect sense.
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Re: Thinker - 2008-07-17 |
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» @Games4JAmes
Well, G4J, here's my take on this, but first of all, let me provide the disclaimer for not having vested interests - as seems to be the norm nowadays ;) - I have a 60 GB PS3, a 20 GB 360 and a Wii (that's right, got the Wii a few days ago :) ), so please no one go down the tried-and-tested path of accusing me to be a fb.
Anyways, while I appreciate that this move will allow 360 gamers to enjoy what is most probably a good RPG, I am disturbed by what I see Microsoft doing, and what I see them doing is them employing the same underhanded business tactics (bribing and strong-arming) to win the console war that they used to gain dominance with their OS and the Browser wars. At the end, Microsoft did succeed with using their unethical methods, and what did we, the consumers, get in return? A stagnant, non-evolving Browser (IE5 + IE6), and an OS riddled with holes as MS did not have the motive to better their products.
At the rate they are going, bribing developers right and left, they probably will win the console wars, and then where will we be? Do you think MS would have been maneuvered into a 1-billion customer service plan if there had been no competition? They would simply have come out with a sh1tty console, refused any kind of repairing and wouldn't have bothered with getting their hardware problems straightened out.
Also, as you have been so insightful as to point out that SE have to make money, why are they not making the 360-exclusives, like Infinite Undiscovery, multiplatform? Wouldn't that also mean more revenue, especially as the PS3 install-base is not insignificant now?
I see you dissing all PS3 fanboy posts - do you do the same to 360 fanboys as well, or is this contribution of yours PS3-exclusive? ;)
Well, G4J, here's my take on this, but first of all, let me provide the disclaimer for not having vested interests - as seems to be the norm nowadays ;) - I have a 60 GB PS3, a 20 GB 360 and a Wii (that's right, got the Wii a few days ago :) ), so please no one go down the tried-and-tested path of accusing me to be a fb.
Anyways, while I appreciate that this move will allow 360 gamers to enjoy what is most probably a good RPG, I am disturbed by what I see Microsoft doing, and what I see them doing is them employing the same underhanded business tactics (bribing and strong-arming) to win the console war that they used to gain dominance with their OS and the Browser wars. At the end, Microsoft did succeed with using their unethical methods, and what did we, the consumers, get in return? A stagnant, non-evolving Browser (IE5 + IE6), and an OS riddled with holes as MS did not have the motive to better their products.
At the rate they are going, bribing developers right and left, they probably will win the console wars, and then where will we be? Do you think MS would have been maneuvered into a 1-billion customer service plan if there had been no competition? They would simply have come out with a sh1tty console, refused any kind of repairing and wouldn't have bothered with getting their hardware problems straightened out.
Also, as you have been so insightful as to point out that SE have to make money, why are they not making the 360-exclusives, like Infinite Undiscovery, multiplatform? Wouldn't that also mean more revenue, especially as the PS3 install-base is not insignificant now?
I see you dissing all PS3 fanboy posts - do you do the same to 360 fanboys as well, or is this contribution of yours PS3-exclusive? ;)
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Re: Thinker - 2008-07-17 |
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» @Games4James
Having said the above, I also want to add that Sony are a little arrogant if they think Devs will not jump ship because they are Sony.
People will be people, and Devs - who, after all people - will wag their tails if MS waves a bag of money (case in point, Rockstar and Bethesda with their DLC, and SE with their multiplat-decison while keeping some games exclusive for the 360).
So, instead of grumbling and muttering and saying "Oh well", Sony should jump on the bandwagon and join this bribe-fest :), if that's the only way they can keep up.
Having said the above, I also want to add that Sony are a little arrogant if they think Devs will not jump ship because they are Sony.
People will be people, and Devs - who, after all people - will wag their tails if MS waves a bag of money (case in point, Rockstar and Bethesda with their DLC, and SE with their multiplat-decison while keeping some games exclusive for the 360).
So, instead of grumbling and muttering and saying "Oh well", Sony should jump on the bandwagon and join this bribe-fest :), if that's the only way they can keep up.
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Re: sickofitall - 2008-07-17 |
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» amen,
Thinker.
Thinker.
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Re: i3obtl - 2008-07-17 |
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» Sony and Disney
You should all remember that Sony has some pretty big ties with Disney, and since KH is a Disney based game, you can count on it not coming to anything M$
You should all remember that Sony has some pretty big ties with Disney, and since KH is a Disney based game, you can count on it not coming to anything M$
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Re: Thinker - 2008-07-17 |
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» @sickofitall
:))
To all the devs:
Line Up! Please! And let the bidding begin!!!
:))
To all the devs:
Line Up! Please! And let the bidding begin!!!
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Re: Donciclon - 2008-07-17 |
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» @thinker
Damn, you really live up to that name thinker...
i never really thought about it that way. I'm well aware of the BS that microsoft pulls off with its windows and stuff (i've been a religious Linux user for about half a year now, want something done right you gotta do it yourself), but i didn't have the foresight to compare their business ethics to the console war. Hopefully this is a perpetual tug of war, it's the only way we'll ever get decent service and products. I guess i never really looked at it from a business point of view, maybe because i always viewed consoles as toys (what appeals to little kids is quantity not quality). And being that home entertainment is a multibillion dollar a year industry, i see how it's the time for major competition to be had.
thanks from a fellow thinker
Damn, you really live up to that name thinker...
i never really thought about it that way. I'm well aware of the BS that microsoft pulls off with its windows and stuff (i've been a religious Linux user for about half a year now, want something done right you gotta do it yourself), but i didn't have the foresight to compare their business ethics to the console war. Hopefully this is a perpetual tug of war, it's the only way we'll ever get decent service and products. I guess i never really looked at it from a business point of view, maybe because i always viewed consoles as toys (what appeals to little kids is quantity not quality). And being that home entertainment is a multibillion dollar a year industry, i see how it's the time for major competition to be had.
thanks from a fellow thinker
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Re: Mister Common Sense - 2008-07-17 |
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» .
Even if Microsoft paid to have FF13 come to the 360, what's the problem? It's still coming to the PS3 first.
To Thinker: I'm really disapointed to see you get a Wii. What were you thinking?
There's always going to be competiton between 3 companies, it's always been that way in the gaming world. If you consider the Wii competiton anyway....
Even if Microsoft paid to have FF13 come to the 360, what's the problem? It's still coming to the PS3 first.
To Thinker: I'm really disapointed to see you get a Wii. What were you thinking?
There's always going to be competiton between 3 companies, it's always been that way in the gaming world. If you consider the Wii competiton anyway....
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Re: habsfan9 - 2008-07-17 |
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» Actually...
They're going to release FFXIII on the 360 and the PS3 simultaneously. They will just finish development on the PS3 first.
They're going to release FFXIII on the 360 and the PS3 simultaneously. They will just finish development on the PS3 first.
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Re: GR1M - 2008-07-17 |
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» Backstabbing??? More like misleading
I have all three systems as well. My problem is, like most, that I bought a PS3 recently for exclusive titles, mainly Final Fantasy. Obviously going multiplatform is the way to go if you want to make money but companies should be honest from the start. Now I pretty much threw away all that money for a game that I could have had on my 360. SE I used to love you, now I hope you rot in hell.
I have all three systems as well. My problem is, like most, that I bought a PS3 recently for exclusive titles, mainly Final Fantasy. Obviously going multiplatform is the way to go if you want to make money but companies should be honest from the start. Now I pretty much threw away all that money for a game that I could have had on my 360. SE I used to love you, now I hope you rot in hell.
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Re: Thinker - 2008-07-17 |
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» @Mister Common Sense
Hey MCS,
Long time since we talked! Nice to hear from you.
As for MS paying off SE, please see the reasons above. I don't care that 360 gamers get to play it. As far as gamers are concerned, the more the better. The reason I am concerned is that MS has set out to win a console war through lying/cheating/stealing/bribing - however you want to look at it, and history has shown that these unethical tactics of MS have worked for them in the past (although Supreme Courts may have penalized them for this later on, it is too late for the company which was trod underfoot by Microsoft's unsavory business practices). I fear that something similar might happen here, and if that were ever to happen, you can say goodbye to hardware and software quality. MS has a long track record of edging and strong-arming competition out of the market and then establishing a monopoly. If you don't see that coming, then you are blind.
As for buying a Wii, sorry to disappoint you :), but I would like to give the console a chance before I diss it. Even though the graphics on it are meh, it's not so bad. It's fun enough for casual gaming. I even got my wife and sister-in-law to join in, which is an achievement in itself. They always used to look at me with disdain whenever they saw me play a game on the PS3 or 360. Hopefully this changes their views of those consoles as well :) . I even bought "Super Mario Galaxy".
Anyway, I think having all consoles gives me the best of all worlds. Wouldn't you agree?
BTW, MCS, I forgot to add your PSN and 360 IDs and have forgotten them. Can you post them again? I think it was Biznich Bioch something, but not sure.
Regards,
MTK
Hey MCS,
Long time since we talked! Nice to hear from you.
As for MS paying off SE, please see the reasons above. I don't care that 360 gamers get to play it. As far as gamers are concerned, the more the better. The reason I am concerned is that MS has set out to win a console war through lying/cheating/stealing/bribing - however you want to look at it, and history has shown that these unethical tactics of MS have worked for them in the past (although Supreme Courts may have penalized them for this later on, it is too late for the company which was trod underfoot by Microsoft's unsavory business practices). I fear that something similar might happen here, and if that were ever to happen, you can say goodbye to hardware and software quality. MS has a long track record of edging and strong-arming competition out of the market and then establishing a monopoly. If you don't see that coming, then you are blind.
As for buying a Wii, sorry to disappoint you :), but I would like to give the console a chance before I diss it. Even though the graphics on it are meh, it's not so bad. It's fun enough for casual gaming. I even got my wife and sister-in-law to join in, which is an achievement in itself. They always used to look at me with disdain whenever they saw me play a game on the PS3 or 360. Hopefully this changes their views of those consoles as well :) . I even bought "Super Mario Galaxy".
Anyway, I think having all consoles gives me the best of all worlds. Wouldn't you agree?
BTW, MCS, I forgot to add your PSN and 360 IDs and have forgotten them. Can you post them again? I think it was Biznich Bioch something, but not sure.
Regards,
MTK
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Re: Games4James - 2008-07-18 |
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» @Thinker
You said "so please no one go down the tried-and-tested path of accusing me to be a fb" but then at the end of your post you go down that _same_ tried-and-tested path by suggesting I could be a fb when you said "I see you dissing all PS3 fanboy posts - do you do the same to 360 fanboys as well, or is this contribution of yours PS3-exclusive? ;)"
Smiley or not, you're being a bit of a hypocrite there. :)
This is about FFXIII on the 360, something which will only anger PS3 fanboys (as we've seen), not 360 fanboys. On other topics, the reverse is true, with angry 360 fanboys, and so things will be different.....there.
So getting back to this topic, there is no evidence that FFXIII coming to the 360 was due to MS carrying out "underhanded business tactics" by "bribing and strong-arming" Square Enix (and since when were SE so weak?). If anything, MS would have had to practically beg to have FFXIII on the 360, NO-WAY could they bully Square Enix into porting the game.
But if you have evidence of MS bribing and strong-arming Square Enix to get FFXIII on the 360, then do provide it please. Otherwise you're just complaining over your own assumptions here. :)
Personally, I don't care how 'bad' or 'evil' MS are suppose to be, I'm just interested in what they can do for me as a gamer. Same with Sony, same with Nintendo (neither of which are any 'nicer' than MS). That said, if a company has to do whatever it takes to offer more and better games for me as a gamer, then I'm all for it.
Sony have boasted that they didn't need to offer devs incentives to develop games on their consoles, and this was true, but it was only true because they were by FAR the market leaders with the Playstation and PS2. Devs came to them because that's where the user base was and therefore that's where the money was. If Sony were 2nd and 3rd in those previous gens, then they would have needed to adopt the same tactics as MS and fight for devs and games for their console.
So as you say Thinker, Sony are arrogant, they haven't really had to fight before, and therefore they still expect devs to come to them and stay with them in the way they did with the Playstation and PS2. But things are different now, Sony are not the market leaders this gen, and therefore they have to learn to fight for the devs, fight for the games, and fight to keep them, something they've been slow to realize it seems.
Finally, how do we know if any of SE's 360 exclusives will not appear on the PS3 sometime in the future? As we've seen time and time again this gen, nothing is guarenteed in terms of 3rd party console exclusives, and FFXIII is a perfect example of that.
You said "so please no one go down the tried-and-tested path of accusing me to be a fb" but then at the end of your post you go down that _same_ tried-and-tested path by suggesting I could be a fb when you said "I see you dissing all PS3 fanboy posts - do you do the same to 360 fanboys as well, or is this contribution of yours PS3-exclusive? ;)"
Smiley or not, you're being a bit of a hypocrite there. :)
This is about FFXIII on the 360, something which will only anger PS3 fanboys (as we've seen), not 360 fanboys. On other topics, the reverse is true, with angry 360 fanboys, and so things will be different.....there.
So getting back to this topic, there is no evidence that FFXIII coming to the 360 was due to MS carrying out "underhanded business tactics" by "bribing and strong-arming" Square Enix (and since when were SE so weak?). If anything, MS would have had to practically beg to have FFXIII on the 360, NO-WAY could they bully Square Enix into porting the game.
But if you have evidence of MS bribing and strong-arming Square Enix to get FFXIII on the 360, then do provide it please. Otherwise you're just complaining over your own assumptions here. :)
Personally, I don't care how 'bad' or 'evil' MS are suppose to be, I'm just interested in what they can do for me as a gamer. Same with Sony, same with Nintendo (neither of which are any 'nicer' than MS). That said, if a company has to do whatever it takes to offer more and better games for me as a gamer, then I'm all for it.
Sony have boasted that they didn't need to offer devs incentives to develop games on their consoles, and this was true, but it was only true because they were by FAR the market leaders with the Playstation and PS2. Devs came to them because that's where the user base was and therefore that's where the money was. If Sony were 2nd and 3rd in those previous gens, then they would have needed to adopt the same tactics as MS and fight for devs and games for their console.
So as you say Thinker, Sony are arrogant, they haven't really had to fight before, and therefore they still expect devs to come to them and stay with them in the way they did with the Playstation and PS2. But things are different now, Sony are not the market leaders this gen, and therefore they have to learn to fight for the devs, fight for the games, and fight to keep them, something they've been slow to realize it seems.
Finally, how do we know if any of SE's 360 exclusives will not appear on the PS3 sometime in the future? As we've seen time and time again this gen, nothing is guarenteed in terms of 3rd party console exclusives, and FFXIII is a perfect example of that.
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Re: ultimax - 2008-07-18 |
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» Hmm
You neek. Nuff said.
You neek. Nuff said.
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Re: Thinker - 2008-07-18 |
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» @Games4James
Hi G4J,
Long time since we exchanged words :). Nice to see you respond. I was beginning to think you had moved on to another thread.
Anyway, whether you want to accuse me of being a hypocrite or not - that is your prerogative. For myself, I know that my conscience is clear. I am fairly open about things. Yes, I have made no secret of the fact that I own all three consoles and that I still prefer the PS3, and I believe my reasons, although subjective, are well-founded.
Anyway, since you've accused me, let me tell you that in the past I've criticised not only 360 fanboys, but also PS3 fanboys. Take Stealth, for example. I don't remember the exact thread, but if you search, you will find instances where I have criticised PS3 fanboys. You, on the other hand, I have seen online several times, but NEVER have I seen you criticise a 360 fanboy. Maybe you did and maybe I missed those posts, but I have yet to see you be impartial.
As for FFXIII, nice job of putting a spin on my words "bribing and strong-arming" so as to make me appear in a negative light. I never said they used BOTH for THIS particular game. NO I DO NOT THINK MS STRONG-ARMED SQUARE-ENIX INTO GOING MULTI-PLAT FOR THIS GAME (and that is because they DO NOT HAVE THE LEVERAGE TO, not because of any ethical conundrums), and yes, I DO THINK they bribed SE for the following two reasons:
1) To get FFXIII on their console
2) PS3 version was obviously going to be finished earlier. In order to ensure that the PS3 version did not come out earlier
I'm not an industry insider and can't provide the necessary proof. However, what I'm basing my argument on is 1) Microsoft's PROVEN TRACK RECORD of using these business practices, and 2) common sense. Sure, you can convince yourself that MS didn't offer a single cent to get this game, and that in itself would prove, at least to me, where your bias lies.
"That said, if a company has to do whatever it takes to offer more and better games for me as a gamer, then I'm all for it."
-> And that's where you are being blind. We have clear evidence (out there on Wikipedia, Answers, News channels, wherever you care to look) that whenever Microsoft manages to establish itself as a monopoly in ANYTHING, it is the Consumer who suffers. If you don't believe that, then you have been living in Planet Fantasia, my friend.
What I'm saying is, if MS continues with these UNDER-HANDED tactics, their history has shown that they WILL SUCCEED in establishing themselves as a monopoly in the hardcore gamer market (which, as you probably know, is a multi-billion dollar industry, and is NOT about toys or just games), and if and when that happens, you can kiss "better games" and "good hardware" goodbye. If you think that's not true, then you ARE a MS fanboy, and I stand by that statement.
You can accuse me of whatever the hell you want, but my conscience is clear whenever I post something. The way you evaded and dodged my question "or is this contribution of yours PS3-exclusive?" makes me think I can't say the same about you.
Regards,
MTK
Hi G4J,
Long time since we exchanged words :). Nice to see you respond. I was beginning to think you had moved on to another thread.
Anyway, whether you want to accuse me of being a hypocrite or not - that is your prerogative. For myself, I know that my conscience is clear. I am fairly open about things. Yes, I have made no secret of the fact that I own all three consoles and that I still prefer the PS3, and I believe my reasons, although subjective, are well-founded.
Anyway, since you've accused me, let me tell you that in the past I've criticised not only 360 fanboys, but also PS3 fanboys. Take Stealth, for example. I don't remember the exact thread, but if you search, you will find instances where I have criticised PS3 fanboys. You, on the other hand, I have seen online several times, but NEVER have I seen you criticise a 360 fanboy. Maybe you did and maybe I missed those posts, but I have yet to see you be impartial.
As for FFXIII, nice job of putting a spin on my words "bribing and strong-arming" so as to make me appear in a negative light. I never said they used BOTH for THIS particular game. NO I DO NOT THINK MS STRONG-ARMED SQUARE-ENIX INTO GOING MULTI-PLAT FOR THIS GAME (and that is because they DO NOT HAVE THE LEVERAGE TO, not because of any ethical conundrums), and yes, I DO THINK they bribed SE for the following two reasons:
1) To get FFXIII on their console
2) PS3 version was obviously going to be finished earlier. In order to ensure that the PS3 version did not come out earlier
I'm not an industry insider and can't provide the necessary proof. However, what I'm basing my argument on is 1) Microsoft's PROVEN TRACK RECORD of using these business practices, and 2) common sense. Sure, you can convince yourself that MS didn't offer a single cent to get this game, and that in itself would prove, at least to me, where your bias lies.
"That said, if a company has to do whatever it takes to offer more and better games for me as a gamer, then I'm all for it."
-> And that's where you are being blind. We have clear evidence (out there on Wikipedia, Answers, News channels, wherever you care to look) that whenever Microsoft manages to establish itself as a monopoly in ANYTHING, it is the Consumer who suffers. If you don't believe that, then you have been living in Planet Fantasia, my friend.
What I'm saying is, if MS continues with these UNDER-HANDED tactics, their history has shown that they WILL SUCCEED in establishing themselves as a monopoly in the hardcore gamer market (which, as you probably know, is a multi-billion dollar industry, and is NOT about toys or just games), and if and when that happens, you can kiss "better games" and "good hardware" goodbye. If you think that's not true, then you ARE a MS fanboy, and I stand by that statement.
You can accuse me of whatever the hell you want, but my conscience is clear whenever I post something. The way you evaded and dodged my question "or is this contribution of yours PS3-exclusive?" makes me think I can't say the same about you.
Regards,
MTK
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Re: Thinker - 2008-07-18 |
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» @Games4James
"you ARE a MS fanboy, and I stand by that statement. "
-> This is my opinion based upon the slant of EVERY SINGLE ONE of your posts THAT I HAVE SEEN. What keeps you apart from them is that you are WAY MORE ERUDITE and ARTICULATE. But you still say the same things, only in a much more polished way.
"you ARE a MS fanboy, and I stand by that statement. "
-> This is my opinion based upon the slant of EVERY SINGLE ONE of your posts THAT I HAVE SEEN. What keeps you apart from them is that you are WAY MORE ERUDITE and ARTICULATE. But you still say the same things, only in a much more polished way.
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Re: Thinker - 2008-07-18 |
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» @Games4James
Also,
This is something I have seen you ALWAYS do. whenever I accuse you of being a fanboy, instead of providing an appropriate response, you side-step that question and ALWAYS accuse me of being a fanboy/hypocrite myself, and as proof of your statement, you offer my accusation. I find that to be really cheap.
Sorry for taking the gloves off, but this is something I've ALWAYS seen you do whenever I point out you are doing something fanboyish.
For my part, since you accused me of being a hypocrite (and, by implication, a fanboy) WHERE in my post did I indicate that FFXIII coming to the 360 is BAD for gamers? Point out the line, and I'll gladly accept you are right. I have this history on QJ. If I'm wrong, I HAVE accepted it. The same can't be said of you. Maybe you think you are ALWAYS right, but try to look through others' eyes as well.
All I said was, game coming to 360 - good, the means employed for bringing this and other games to the 360 - bad in the LONG RUN.
How does that make me a fanboy? I used to look at your posts with a certain respect, but I'm afraid, by your evasion and accusation, you lost that.
Sorry for the strong words. Just angry at bringing up a post relating to business practices and being accused of being a fanboy.
Also,
This is something I have seen you ALWAYS do. whenever I accuse you of being a fanboy, instead of providing an appropriate response, you side-step that question and ALWAYS accuse me of being a fanboy/hypocrite myself, and as proof of your statement, you offer my accusation. I find that to be really cheap.
Sorry for taking the gloves off, but this is something I've ALWAYS seen you do whenever I point out you are doing something fanboyish.
For my part, since you accused me of being a hypocrite (and, by implication, a fanboy) WHERE in my post did I indicate that FFXIII coming to the 360 is BAD for gamers? Point out the line, and I'll gladly accept you are right. I have this history on QJ. If I'm wrong, I HAVE accepted it. The same can't be said of you. Maybe you think you are ALWAYS right, but try to look through others' eyes as well.
All I said was, game coming to 360 - good, the means employed for bringing this and other games to the 360 - bad in the LONG RUN.
How does that make me a fanboy? I used to look at your posts with a certain respect, but I'm afraid, by your evasion and accusation, you lost that.
Sorry for the strong words. Just angry at bringing up a post relating to business practices and being accused of being a fanboy.
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Re: Games4James - 2008-07-21 |
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» Think whatever you like Thinker...
...you ARE as much a PS3/Sony fanboy as I am a MS/360 fanboy.
And I have criticised 360 fanboys, just because YOU haven't seen it doesn't mean I haven't done so. Likewise, I haven't seen you criticise PS3 fanboys, but that doesn't mean you haven't added a token criticism against a PS3 fanboy every now and again. ;)
As you say, you have no proof to your arguments, hence that says it all really. Your arguments are baseless, and therefore it seems foolish to go overboard over speculation, and especially to your claim that MS could result in a future without better games and better hardware.
That's the same BS argument Nintendo fanboys used to use against Sony regarding the Playstation, claiming Sony are only interested in quantity over quality, and therefore claimed Sony would flood the market with cr*p and thus bring about the eventual downfall of the games industry.
Did it happen? No. Similar arguments were made regarding MS entering the console market with the XBox ("they are only in it for the money", "they will ruin the games market" etc), and did it happen? Nope. Will it happen? No. So cut out the nonsense please. The games industry is far stronger than that, and it thrives on competition, and whilst ALL the major three companies would like to dominate as much as possible, ALL three are aware that as much as they want to dominate, they also NEED the competition for the market to grow.
"All I said was, game coming to 360 - good, the means employed for bringing this and other games to the 360 - bad in the LONG RUN."
And all I said was I disagree, especially given the fact that you don't know the means employed to make this happen, you can only speculate, and even if it was true, I don't see it as bad in the long run at all.
"How does that make me a fanboy? I used to look at your posts with a certain respect, but I'm afraid, by your evasion and accusation, you lost that."
Well given your posts on QJ, I lost respect for you a long time ago, since you're just a closet fanboy (deny it all you like), so I guess the feeling is mutual. :)
"Sorry for the strong words. Just angry at bringing up a post relating to business practices and being accused of being a fanboy."
I see, so it's ok for you to call me a fanboy at the end of that first post, but when I direct the same accusation towards yourself, you are ever so shocked and offended! R-i-g-h-t.
From William Shakespeare's Hamlet, the Queen says "The lady doth protest too much, methinks", hence likewise, I feel that over being called a fanboy "You doth protest too much, methinks." :P
Have a nice day.
...you ARE as much a PS3/Sony fanboy as I am a MS/360 fanboy.
And I have criticised 360 fanboys, just because YOU haven't seen it doesn't mean I haven't done so. Likewise, I haven't seen you criticise PS3 fanboys, but that doesn't mean you haven't added a token criticism against a PS3 fanboy every now and again. ;)
As you say, you have no proof to your arguments, hence that says it all really. Your arguments are baseless, and therefore it seems foolish to go overboard over speculation, and especially to your claim that MS could result in a future without better games and better hardware.
That's the same BS argument Nintendo fanboys used to use against Sony regarding the Playstation, claiming Sony are only interested in quantity over quality, and therefore claimed Sony would flood the market with cr*p and thus bring about the eventual downfall of the games industry.
Did it happen? No. Similar arguments were made regarding MS entering the console market with the XBox ("they are only in it for the money", "they will ruin the games market" etc), and did it happen? Nope. Will it happen? No. So cut out the nonsense please. The games industry is far stronger than that, and it thrives on competition, and whilst ALL the major three companies would like to dominate as much as possible, ALL three are aware that as much as they want to dominate, they also NEED the competition for the market to grow.
"All I said was, game coming to 360 - good, the means employed for bringing this and other games to the 360 - bad in the LONG RUN."
And all I said was I disagree, especially given the fact that you don't know the means employed to make this happen, you can only speculate, and even if it was true, I don't see it as bad in the long run at all.
"How does that make me a fanboy? I used to look at your posts with a certain respect, but I'm afraid, by your evasion and accusation, you lost that."
Well given your posts on QJ, I lost respect for you a long time ago, since you're just a closet fanboy (deny it all you like), so I guess the feeling is mutual. :)
"Sorry for the strong words. Just angry at bringing up a post relating to business practices and being accused of being a fanboy."
I see, so it's ok for you to call me a fanboy at the end of that first post, but when I direct the same accusation towards yourself, you are ever so shocked and offended! R-i-g-h-t.
From William Shakespeare's Hamlet, the Queen says "The lady doth protest too much, methinks", hence likewise, I feel that over being called a fanboy "You doth protest too much, methinks." :P
Have a nice day.
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Re: Games4James - 2008-07-21 |
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» And finally
Being biased towards a specific company or console does not make someone a fanboy Thinker, since a fanboy is a label given to someone who's support for one side is matched by their hatred for the other side.
Hence no matter how biased you feel someone is towards one console or company, by their comments or actions, they are not fanboys unless that biased results in a similar dislike for part or all of the competition.
Think about that next time before you play the fanboy card, and perhaps you will avoid being upset if that card is thrown back at you.
So to quote myself "you ARE as much a PS3/Sony fanboy as I am a MS/360 fanboy". Think about what that means in light of what I've just said, and then perhaps next time the discussion would be a little more polite all round.
Being biased towards a specific company or console does not make someone a fanboy Thinker, since a fanboy is a label given to someone who's support for one side is matched by their hatred for the other side.
Hence no matter how biased you feel someone is towards one console or company, by their comments or actions, they are not fanboys unless that biased results in a similar dislike for part or all of the competition.
Think about that next time before you play the fanboy card, and perhaps you will avoid being upset if that card is thrown back at you.
So to quote myself "you ARE as much a PS3/Sony fanboy as I am a MS/360 fanboy". Think about what that means in light of what I've just said, and then perhaps next time the discussion would be a little more polite all round.
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Re: Games4James - 2008-07-21 |
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» And finally finally Thinker
I just read through this thread again, and I think you're WAY over the top in the way you turned on me here, which I find very disappointing (hence my equally aggresive response).
Read it yourself and you'll see that I called you a hypocrite in response to your strong implication that I was a fanboy.
Calling you a hypocrite was NOT implying you are a fanboy, it was in response to the fact that you started your post by saying no-one should call YOU a fanboy, but you ended it by suggesting I'M a fanboy. That was the hypocracy I was referring to.
But after that ONE remark from me in defense (what did you expect btw?), you seem to have wound yourself up more and more with each new post, eventually responding as if I'd posted a lengthy attack against you .
So suddenly the gloves were off (as you said) and there you were giving me a really good kicking. Well thanks for nothing Thinker.
Perhaps you had a bad day, I don't know, but I do know that I didn't do you anything to justify that series of attacks from you. :(
I just read through this thread again, and I think you're WAY over the top in the way you turned on me here, which I find very disappointing (hence my equally aggresive response).
Read it yourself and you'll see that I called you a hypocrite in response to your strong implication that I was a fanboy.
Calling you a hypocrite was NOT implying you are a fanboy, it was in response to the fact that you started your post by saying no-one should call YOU a fanboy, but you ended it by suggesting I'M a fanboy. That was the hypocracy I was referring to.
But after that ONE remark from me in defense (what did you expect btw?), you seem to have wound yourself up more and more with each new post, eventually responding as if I'd posted a lengthy attack against you .
So suddenly the gloves were off (as you said) and there you were giving me a really good kicking. Well thanks for nothing Thinker.
Perhaps you had a bad day, I don't know, but I do know that I didn't do you anything to justify that series of attacks from you. :(
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Re: Thinker - 2008-07-22 |
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» @Games4James
"Think whatever you like Thinker......you ARE as much a PS3/Sony fanboy as I am a MS/360 fanboy."
-> You can say whatever you like, and if you feel you are fair and impartial, more power to you. As for that jab about token criticisms, I don't know whether QJ offers a search facility to search by User's posts (haven't tried - although I do know I can search out MY posts), you can look at my posts and decide for yourself. As I said, I speak from the viewpoint of owning and playing all three consoles. Don't know where you are coming from yourself.
"foolish to go overboard over speculation, and especially to your claim that MS could result in a future without better games and better hardware."
-> Well, the thing is, Nintendo fans may have expressed similar fears about Sony, but Sony is no MS. You really think what MS has done in the past with other products may not happen here?
"ALL three are aware that as much as they want to dominate, they also NEED the competition for the market to grow."
-> Well, do you really think anybody who wants to dominate WANTS competitors? Come on! All I'm saying is that MS has paid off developers in the past, and this sudden move makes me think this is how they got this one as well. And Microsoft has certainly successfully established itself as a monopoly in other markets, usually to the detriment of innovation (I'm sure you are aware of the Browser wars, and how they stayed stagnant for a long time until Firefox forced them to start moving again). All I'm saying is I don't prefer a gaming market where the only thing you see around for miles is MS, MS and MS, with no choices and Internet Explorer-5 like "innovation" and Windows-like "stability".
"Well given your posts on QJ, I lost respect for you a long time ago, since you're just a closet fanboy (deny it all you like), so I guess the feeling is mutual. :)"
-> As I said, you can think what you like - and convince yourself that I'm not even aware that I'm one :) - all I know is, I have tried out all present-gen consoles, own all of these, and regularly buy games for and play all of these. So you can pat yourself on the back thinking you've done your psycho-analysis bit on me if that makes you feel all warm inside ;) - I know where I'm coming from. But about this part "feeling is mutual", I'm afraid you are right. I guess the feeling of contempt is mutual, although I wish this weren't so - as I had hoped that given your polished language, you were someone with whom proper debates could be held, but no - you seemed to think only PS3 supporters required dismissal. As for a closet fanboy, you may need to go no farther than the mirror to find one :).
"I see, so it's ok for you to call me a fanboy at the end of that first post, but when I direct the same accusation towards yourself, you are ever so shocked and offended! R-i-g-h-t."
-> Let's go through a summary of my first post, shall we: I said this is what I think MS is doing, and looking at MS's business tactics and ESTABLISHED history, I think this is what is going to happen. Then I say I think your posts only seem to single out PS3-supporters (notice I didn't say FANBOY - you were the one who brought out that word). Then, your first response to my post seems to be an accusation of FANBOY to counter the statement I made about the general slant of your posts. Who was being touchy there? :) . After which, (in my eyes) you trid to twist my words about MS' methods, ignore ALL of MS past history and imply that this move towards a possible gaming monopoly is in our best interests. And then you think that shouldn't touch a nerve?
Well, nice to know you read some of the classics (I haven't - and this is not sarcasm about being knowledgeable abt classics). Afraid I don't know any appropriate quotes for this instance. As for your quote, I guess it falls in-line with what you've managed to convince yourself about me.
As for a dislike about the competition, what should I dislike? The console I own (a 360?) or on which I have played several games? In my mind, I li
"Think whatever you like Thinker......you ARE as much a PS3/Sony fanboy as I am a MS/360 fanboy."
-> You can say whatever you like, and if you feel you are fair and impartial, more power to you. As for that jab about token criticisms, I don't know whether QJ offers a search facility to search by User's posts (haven't tried - although I do know I can search out MY posts), you can look at my posts and decide for yourself. As I said, I speak from the viewpoint of owning and playing all three consoles. Don't know where you are coming from yourself.
"foolish to go overboard over speculation, and especially to your claim that MS could result in a future without better games and better hardware."
-> Well, the thing is, Nintendo fans may have expressed similar fears about Sony, but Sony is no MS. You really think what MS has done in the past with other products may not happen here?
"ALL three are aware that as much as they want to dominate, they also NEED the competition for the market to grow."
-> Well, do you really think anybody who wants to dominate WANTS competitors? Come on! All I'm saying is that MS has paid off developers in the past, and this sudden move makes me think this is how they got this one as well. And Microsoft has certainly successfully established itself as a monopoly in other markets, usually to the detriment of innovation (I'm sure you are aware of the Browser wars, and how they stayed stagnant for a long time until Firefox forced them to start moving again). All I'm saying is I don't prefer a gaming market where the only thing you see around for miles is MS, MS and MS, with no choices and Internet Explorer-5 like "innovation" and Windows-like "stability".
"Well given your posts on QJ, I lost respect for you a long time ago, since you're just a closet fanboy (deny it all you like), so I guess the feeling is mutual. :)"
-> As I said, you can think what you like - and convince yourself that I'm not even aware that I'm one :) - all I know is, I have tried out all present-gen consoles, own all of these, and regularly buy games for and play all of these. So you can pat yourself on the back thinking you've done your psycho-analysis bit on me if that makes you feel all warm inside ;) - I know where I'm coming from. But about this part "feeling is mutual", I'm afraid you are right. I guess the feeling of contempt is mutual, although I wish this weren't so - as I had hoped that given your polished language, you were someone with whom proper debates could be held, but no - you seemed to think only PS3 supporters required dismissal. As for a closet fanboy, you may need to go no farther than the mirror to find one :).
"I see, so it's ok for you to call me a fanboy at the end of that first post, but when I direct the same accusation towards yourself, you are ever so shocked and offended! R-i-g-h-t."
-> Let's go through a summary of my first post, shall we: I said this is what I think MS is doing, and looking at MS's business tactics and ESTABLISHED history, I think this is what is going to happen. Then I say I think your posts only seem to single out PS3-supporters (notice I didn't say FANBOY - you were the one who brought out that word). Then, your first response to my post seems to be an accusation of FANBOY to counter the statement I made about the general slant of your posts. Who was being touchy there? :) . After which, (in my eyes) you trid to twist my words about MS' methods, ignore ALL of MS past history and imply that this move towards a possible gaming monopoly is in our best interests. And then you think that shouldn't touch a nerve?
Well, nice to know you read some of the classics (I haven't - and this is not sarcasm about being knowledgeable abt classics). Afraid I don't know any appropriate quotes for this instance. As for your quote, I guess it falls in-line with what you've managed to convince yourself about me.
As for a dislike about the competition, what should I dislike? The console I own (a 360?) or on which I have played several games? In my mind, I li
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Re: Thinker - 2008-07-22 |
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» @Games4James
Sorry - seems QJ can't handle extra-long posts:)
Continued...
As for a dislike about the competition, what should I dislike? The console I own (a 360?) or on which I have played several games? In my mind, I like all three consoles and favor the PS3 because - in my eyes - it is technologically better, more reliable technically and offers more for nearly the same amount of money. This does not mean I dislike the 360 or Wii (or MS and Nintendo), as both have their specific pluses as well. The ONLY THING I DISLIKE (and this is now probably the 10th time I'm saying this) is MS's history of underhandedness and it's habit of staying stagnant and stopping off innovation from competitors once it has established a monopoly, which led me to express my fears. I hope I've made my opinion as clear as possible. No I DO NOT HATE MS, but I do dislike the methods they use to get to the top, or the pond-like tendency they acquire once they get there. If you don't get what I'm saying even now, and still are comfortable thinking I hate MS, then I guess you'll never understand my perspective.
"you'll see that I called you a hypocrite in response to your strong implication that I was a fanboy."
-> Well, I guess it makes you feel vindicated to ASSUME that I accused you of being a fanboy FIRST, but I KNOW that was not the case. I merely said it feels you are always singling out PS3-supporting posts. Still, I know how psychology works, you WANT to feel justified in bashing my post. Go ahead and think whatever you want if that makes you feel any better.
"Perhaps you had a bad day, I don't know, but I do know that I didn't do you anything to justify that series of attacks from you. :( "
-> Well, maybe the SERIES of attacks weren' justified, and I apologize for that, but in my eyes, I NEVER accused you of being a fanboy first, only implied you seem to be singling out PS3-fans. You were the one who accused me of being a hypocrite. So my first reaction, I feel, was justified, although the CHAIN of posts might not have been.
"Think about what that means in light of what I've just said, and then perhaps next time the discussion would be a little more polite all round. "
-> Well, I certainly hope we have a more polite debate next time - although I'm of the mind it requires a willingness to think from the other person's point-of-view as well to make it a debate or a discussion, otherwise it just devolves into an argument, which has what this has become here.
Have a nice day.
Sorry - seems QJ can't handle extra-long posts:)
Continued...
As for a dislike about the competition, what should I dislike? The console I own (a 360?) or on which I have played several games? In my mind, I like all three consoles and favor the PS3 because - in my eyes - it is technologically better, more reliable technically and offers more for nearly the same amount of money. This does not mean I dislike the 360 or Wii (or MS and Nintendo), as both have their specific pluses as well. The ONLY THING I DISLIKE (and this is now probably the 10th time I'm saying this) is MS's history of underhandedness and it's habit of staying stagnant and stopping off innovation from competitors once it has established a monopoly, which led me to express my fears. I hope I've made my opinion as clear as possible. No I DO NOT HATE MS, but I do dislike the methods they use to get to the top, or the pond-like tendency they acquire once they get there. If you don't get what I'm saying even now, and still are comfortable thinking I hate MS, then I guess you'll never understand my perspective.
"you'll see that I called you a hypocrite in response to your strong implication that I was a fanboy."
-> Well, I guess it makes you feel vindicated to ASSUME that I accused you of being a fanboy FIRST, but I KNOW that was not the case. I merely said it feels you are always singling out PS3-supporting posts. Still, I know how psychology works, you WANT to feel justified in bashing my post. Go ahead and think whatever you want if that makes you feel any better.
"Perhaps you had a bad day, I don't know, but I do know that I didn't do you anything to justify that series of attacks from you. :( "
-> Well, maybe the SERIES of attacks weren' justified, and I apologize for that, but in my eyes, I NEVER accused you of being a fanboy first, only implied you seem to be singling out PS3-fans. You were the one who accused me of being a hypocrite. So my first reaction, I feel, was justified, although the CHAIN of posts might not have been.
"Think about what that means in light of what I've just said, and then perhaps next time the discussion would be a little more polite all round. "
-> Well, I certainly hope we have a more polite debate next time - although I'm of the mind it requires a willingness to think from the other person's point-of-view as well to make it a debate or a discussion, otherwise it just devolves into an argument, which has what this has become here.
Have a nice day.
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Re: Games4James - 2008-07-22 |
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» Ok, fine
"Well, maybe the SERIES of attacks weren' justified, and I apologize for that, but in my eyes, I NEVER accused you of being a fanboy first, only implied you seem to be singling out "PS3-fans. You were the one who accused me of being a hypocrite. So my first reaction, I feel, was justified, although the CHAIN of posts might not have been.""
I do feel there was an element of hypocracy in that post, even if unintentional, but that's not what I want to say here, ...
...I want to apologise for some of my comments in response to your chain of attacks against me, I got a little annoyed and it showed. Once I posted it, I wasn't happy with some of the comments (some were just 'tit for tat', including the issue of respect), but you can't edit posts here, and hence I immediately summited the post titled "And finally".
The point of that post (which you've misunderstood unfortunately) was to say that neither of us are fanboys, it was not to support the claim that you're a fanboy.
You are biased towards Sony/PS3 (don't deny it, it shows ;)) and I'm biased towards Microsoft/360 (which also shows), hence we clashed here, but neither of us express a dislike towards the competition, quite the contrary in fact (expect on certain issues perhaps) and therefore neither of us are fanboys. That's what I was saying, hoping to clear the air a little after things got rather heated.
"Well, I certainly hope we have a more polite debate next time - although I'm of the mind it requires a willingness to think from the other person's point-of-view as well to make it a debate or a discussion, otherwise it just devolves into an argument, which has what this has become here."
Agreed, and I think if you're being honest, anger meant we both managed to stray a little from that path here, saying a few things neither of us really meant (I hope), which I believe is unusual behaviour for both of us on QJ.
So I look forward to a better discussion next time. This onw, well I think we'll have to agree to disagree and move on. Agreed? :)
"Well, maybe the SERIES of attacks weren' justified, and I apologize for that, but in my eyes, I NEVER accused you of being a fanboy first, only implied you seem to be singling out "PS3-fans. You were the one who accused me of being a hypocrite. So my first reaction, I feel, was justified, although the CHAIN of posts might not have been.""
I do feel there was an element of hypocracy in that post, even if unintentional, but that's not what I want to say here, ...
...I want to apologise for some of my comments in response to your chain of attacks against me, I got a little annoyed and it showed. Once I posted it, I wasn't happy with some of the comments (some were just 'tit for tat', including the issue of respect), but you can't edit posts here, and hence I immediately summited the post titled "And finally".
The point of that post (which you've misunderstood unfortunately) was to say that neither of us are fanboys, it was not to support the claim that you're a fanboy.
You are biased towards Sony/PS3 (don't deny it, it shows ;)) and I'm biased towards Microsoft/360 (which also shows), hence we clashed here, but neither of us express a dislike towards the competition, quite the contrary in fact (expect on certain issues perhaps) and therefore neither of us are fanboys. That's what I was saying, hoping to clear the air a little after things got rather heated.
"Well, I certainly hope we have a more polite debate next time - although I'm of the mind it requires a willingness to think from the other person's point-of-view as well to make it a debate or a discussion, otherwise it just devolves into an argument, which has what this has become here."
Agreed, and I think if you're being honest, anger meant we both managed to stray a little from that path here, saying a few things neither of us really meant (I hope), which I believe is unusual behaviour for both of us on QJ.
So I look forward to a better discussion next time. This onw, well I think we'll have to agree to disagree and move on. Agreed? :)
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Re: Thinker - 2008-07-22 |
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» @Games4James
"I want to apologise for some of my comments in response to your chain of attacks against me, I got a little annoyed and it showed."
-> Actually, that was me as well, and I guess I got a little carried away too. Apologies :)
"You are biased towards Sony/PS3"
-> I've never denied that. I even say it outright (in my first - or was it second? - post). I do like the PS3, but don't hate MS or Nintendo or shun their products. What they are offering is not bad as well, and so I own and enjoy their consoles too.
"This onw, well I think we'll have to agree to disagree and move on. Agreed? :) "
-> Agreed :)
"I want to apologise for some of my comments in response to your chain of attacks against me, I got a little annoyed and it showed."
-> Actually, that was me as well, and I guess I got a little carried away too. Apologies :)
"You are biased towards Sony/PS3"
-> I've never denied that. I even say it outright (in my first - or was it second? - post). I do like the PS3, but don't hate MS or Nintendo or shun their products. What they are offering is not bad as well, and so I own and enjoy their consoles too.
"This onw, well I think we'll have to agree to disagree and move on. Agreed? :) "
-> Agreed :)
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by Psylink - 2008-07-17 |
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» meh... crybabies
i must say sony fan-boys are the whinest bunch of children
as stated above, square enix did jump ship from nintendo and moved on to other consoles, they go where the money is.
ffxi is on 360, they see that people who played the game on ps2 and pc, actually bought the game a 2nd time just for the xbox360.
honestly i come to qj.net less and less because of all the whiney children and flaming, i quickly scan any news, read what i need and quickly leave the site.
if it is a remake, i will be playing it. i can say i am a fan of the FF franchise, a fan of square-enix, NOT a fan of a console. all of you people complaining on every post relating to ffvii or square "backstabbing" sony. grow up, the game is being released because of fans on multiple systems, if you hate 360 and love ps3... buy it for ps3 and stop complaining over something you can not and will NOT change.
i must say sony fan-boys are the whinest bunch of children
as stated above, square enix did jump ship from nintendo and moved on to other consoles, they go where the money is.
ffxi is on 360, they see that people who played the game on ps2 and pc, actually bought the game a 2nd time just for the xbox360.
honestly i come to qj.net less and less because of all the whiney children and flaming, i quickly scan any news, read what i need and quickly leave the site.
if it is a remake, i will be playing it. i can say i am a fan of the FF franchise, a fan of square-enix, NOT a fan of a console. all of you people complaining on every post relating to ffvii or square "backstabbing" sony. grow up, the game is being released because of fans on multiple systems, if you hate 360 and love ps3... buy it for ps3 and stop complaining over something you can not and will NOT change.
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by mpcooper - 2008-07-17 |
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» OMG
OMG maybe its a brand new game that isnt Final Fantasy 29 or Kingdom Hearts 9. Seriously Though their are way too many remakes and not enough new games coming out. Maybe SE big news is that their porting FF7 to the psp or ds or releasing it with the other final fantasy games.
OMG maybe its a brand new game that isnt Final Fantasy 29 or Kingdom Hearts 9. Seriously Though their are way too many remakes and not enough new games coming out. Maybe SE big news is that their porting FF7 to the psp or ds or releasing it with the other final fantasy games.
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by Rasb23 - 2008-07-17 |
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» Just be happy!
They said they're releasing it for 360 and PS3? So what the he11 is the problem? On more systems so more people can play it. Why be upset cause the jerk down the road can play it on his system but you want him to have to buy the system you own for him to play it. Really do some people think before they write?
Just be happy their actually thinking of releasing it and not canceling it.
Just remember Final Fantasy started at 1 not 7, there are more FF games on Nintendo then any other system and there are other games in this world beside FF.
They said they're releasing it for 360 and PS3? So what the he11 is the problem? On more systems so more people can play it. Why be upset cause the jerk down the road can play it on his system but you want him to have to buy the system you own for him to play it. Really do some people think before they write?
Just be happy their actually thinking of releasing it and not canceling it.
Just remember Final Fantasy started at 1 not 7, there are more FF games on Nintendo then any other system and there are other games in this world beside FF.
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by Keith K - 2008-07-17 |
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» Hmmm
As much as I was disappointed that FFXIII will be on Xbox, it has nothing to do with loyalty to Sony. It was more disappointing to realize I was lied to by SE and bought a $600 machine based on that lie.
I was also infuriated by the fact that PS3 owners in North America have to wait for the entire game to be ported to Xbox, effectively delaying the game yet another year.. at least.
As for FFVII, the franchise is thoroughly engrained in Sony hardware and beyond. FFVII is obviously a PS1 title, Dirge PS2, Crisis Core PSP and Advent Children a Sony Pictures Film. Tetsuya Nomura is also a Sony fanboy (Hence the continued exclusivity of Versus for the time being.) If there is to be a big FFVII announcement, it is logical to expect it to be in favour of Sony.
As much as I was disappointed that FFXIII will be on Xbox, it has nothing to do with loyalty to Sony. It was more disappointing to realize I was lied to by SE and bought a $600 machine based on that lie.
I was also infuriated by the fact that PS3 owners in North America have to wait for the entire game to be ported to Xbox, effectively delaying the game yet another year.. at least.
As for FFVII, the franchise is thoroughly engrained in Sony hardware and beyond. FFVII is obviously a PS1 title, Dirge PS2, Crisis Core PSP and Advent Children a Sony Pictures Film. Tetsuya Nomura is also a Sony fanboy (Hence the continued exclusivity of Versus for the time being.) If there is to be a big FFVII announcement, it is logical to expect it to be in favour of Sony.
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Re: Games4James - 2008-07-17 |
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» But the US have always had to wait for FF after Japan.
" effectively delaying the game yet another year.. at least."
Look at the following FF release dates;
http://www.bellaonline.com/articles/art9315.asp
So the US version would have been released months after Japan anyway (as with all previous FF games), even if it was still a PS3 exclusive.
And with the game being developed and running on PCs, a 360 port should be relatively painless (they have years of experience putting their games onto multiple disks). So I doubt the 360 will add much (if anything) to delay the game further in the US and Europe. Certainly not a year, 6 months at the most given the previous FF games.
As for SE lying. What lies? If they hadn't decided back then that there will be a 360 version, then they couldn't announce it. They had no choice but to maintain that FFXIII was a PS3 exclusive. They can't announce something they're undecided about, unless you were expecting "FFXIII - Only on PS3...we think, perhaps, perhaps not, we don't know...maybe". ;)
Only after deciding to port the game to the 360 version could they announce it for the console, and this is what we saw at E3.
As for the shocking announcement, let's wait and see.
" effectively delaying the game yet another year.. at least."
Look at the following FF release dates;
http://www.bellaonline.com/articles/art9315.asp
So the US version would have been released months after Japan anyway (as with all previous FF games), even if it was still a PS3 exclusive.
And with the game being developed and running on PCs, a 360 port should be relatively painless (they have years of experience putting their games onto multiple disks). So I doubt the 360 will add much (if anything) to delay the game further in the US and Europe. Certainly not a year, 6 months at the most given the previous FF games.
As for SE lying. What lies? If they hadn't decided back then that there will be a 360 version, then they couldn't announce it. They had no choice but to maintain that FFXIII was a PS3 exclusive. They can't announce something they're undecided about, unless you were expecting "FFXIII - Only on PS3...we think, perhaps, perhaps not, we don't know...maybe". ;)
Only after deciding to port the game to the 360 version could they announce it for the console, and this is what we saw at E3.
As for the shocking announcement, let's wait and see.
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Re: Keith K - 2008-07-17 |
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» Even so
It still takes longer to port a game than localize it. They havent even started the Xbox version yet. There are many hurdles they have yet to encounter and storage and compression issues to deal with. Localization is only a matter of translation, but now it's a matter of so much more than that. And when I say delay a year or more, I mean beyond the 6 month localization period I was already anticipating before the announcement of the 360 version.
It still takes longer to port a game than localize it. They havent even started the Xbox version yet. There are many hurdles they have yet to encounter and storage and compression issues to deal with. Localization is only a matter of translation, but now it's a matter of so much more than that. And when I say delay a year or more, I mean beyond the 6 month localization period I was already anticipating before the announcement of the 360 version.
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Re: Keith K - 2008-07-17 |
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» Also
I question the acceptability of holding back PS3 versions of so many titles and going ahead with the Xbox version to start refilling the coffers. Its completely understandable from a business stand point, as is multiplatform development.
However, why is it suddenly unacceptable to go ahead and get the PS3 version out the door in as timely a fashion as possible when it means coming out on PS3 first instead of Xbox? We do know the PS3 version will be complete before the Xbox version begins. I simply don't understand the double standard.
I question the acceptability of holding back PS3 versions of so many titles and going ahead with the Xbox version to start refilling the coffers. Its completely understandable from a business stand point, as is multiplatform development.
However, why is it suddenly unacceptable to go ahead and get the PS3 version out the door in as timely a fashion as possible when it means coming out on PS3 first instead of Xbox? We do know the PS3 version will be complete before the Xbox version begins. I simply don't understand the double standard.
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Re: mpcooper - 2008-07-17 |
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» ..
Oh you mean like how the Franchise was throughly engrained into Nintendo. Hmm I guess you forgot their were other FF games before FF7 and pretty much all of them were for nintendo. Hell they made Super Mario RPG which was one of the best RPG's I have ever played. Also you notice how SE was with both companies when they were the most popular systems out there and notice how they finally decide to release a FF game for Microsoft when they have a bigger base than Sony.
I wouldn't bother getting too distraught over this I feel bad you bought a PS3 just for this game but I guess this is what happens when you make a expensive console and have to rely on a handful of exclusives to sell your system *cough* halo*cough* , and hey there is always FF14 to look forward to it might be a PS3 Exclusive.
Oh you mean like how the Franchise was throughly engrained into Nintendo. Hmm I guess you forgot their were other FF games before FF7 and pretty much all of them were for nintendo. Hell they made Super Mario RPG which was one of the best RPG's I have ever played. Also you notice how SE was with both companies when they were the most popular systems out there and notice how they finally decide to release a FF game for Microsoft when they have a bigger base than Sony.
I wouldn't bother getting too distraught over this I feel bad you bought a PS3 just for this game but I guess this is what happens when you make a expensive console and have to rely on a handful of exclusives to sell your system *cough* halo*cough* , and hey there is always FF14 to look forward to it might be a PS3 Exclusive.
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Re: Thinker - 2008-07-17 |
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» @Keith K and @Games4James
I think Keith's got a point here. If the roles were reversed and the 360 version was nearing development, would you think they would be waiting for the PS3 version to get finished as well? Just take Alone in the Dark and Fatal Inertia as two examples of this.
I think, G4J, you are being unreasonably supportive of all things MS. I think it is only fair, at least in this, that you call a spade a spade and accept that SE could have pushed out the PS3 version out the door, if it was going to be finished earlier than the 360 version. Porting doesn't take place in a jiffy, or with a snap of the fingers as you seem to imply.
This seems to indicate that not only has MS paid a bunch to get this game, they also paid to have other versions delayed, which seems downright unethical, but then hey, when have MS EVER played the game straight? I call your attention to how MS became the dominant OS market and dominant Browser. If you still think there is nothing unethical about this, then I don't think your point-of-view is impartial.
I could be wrong, but this time, I don't think so. Keith K is right.
I think Keith's got a point here. If the roles were reversed and the 360 version was nearing development, would you think they would be waiting for the PS3 version to get finished as well? Just take Alone in the Dark and Fatal Inertia as two examples of this.
I think, G4J, you are being unreasonably supportive of all things MS. I think it is only fair, at least in this, that you call a spade a spade and accept that SE could have pushed out the PS3 version out the door, if it was going to be finished earlier than the 360 version. Porting doesn't take place in a jiffy, or with a snap of the fingers as you seem to imply.
This seems to indicate that not only has MS paid a bunch to get this game, they also paid to have other versions delayed, which seems downright unethical, but then hey, when have MS EVER played the game straight? I call your attention to how MS became the dominant OS market and dominant Browser. If you still think there is nothing unethical about this, then I don't think your point-of-view is impartial.
I could be wrong, but this time, I don't think so. Keith K is right.
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Re: Keith K - 2008-07-17 |
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» reply
@mpcooper
I said "As for FFVII..." As in the FFVII Compilation. I'm quite aware where the roots of the Final Fantasy series lie. I OWN a Final Fantasy NES cartridge.
@mpcooper
I said "As for FFVII..." As in the FFVII Compilation. I'm quite aware where the roots of the Final Fantasy series lie. I OWN a Final Fantasy NES cartridge.
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Re: mpcooper - 2008-07-17 |
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» ..
@Keith K
Sorry I misunderstood you but it doesn't matter if one title was on a certain system. As I recall the FF1 and FF2 remakes were exclusive to the PSP and not the ds. As for all the other games you mentioned they were made for a system that at the time was the most popular system around. Now that things are shifting around who can say who will get what.
@Keith K
Sorry I misunderstood you but it doesn't matter if one title was on a certain system. As I recall the FF1 and FF2 remakes were exclusive to the PSP and not the ds. As for all the other games you mentioned they were made for a system that at the time was the most popular system around. Now that things are shifting around who can say who will get what.
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Re: Games4James - 2008-07-18 |
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» @Thinker + Keith K
You said "I think, G4J, you are being unreasonably supportive of all things MS."
As I think you're being unreasonably anti-MS and pro-Sony here. See, I can play the same game too. :)
"I think it is only fair, at least in this, that you call a spade a spade and accept that SE could have pushed out the PS3 version out the door, if it was going to be finished earlier than the 360 version."
And I think it's only fair you look at the release dates of previous FF games before jumping to conclusions.
"Porting doesn't take place in a jiffy, or with a snap of the fingers as you seem to imply."
I'm fully aware that porting isn't an instant process, but developement is actually on PCs first, then ported to the PS3, and then ported to the 360.
This is made easier because the game runs on a multi-platform engine, called Crystal Tools (previously known as the White Engine).
The link will not work if I print it here, but this is from Gamespot on Febuary 23rd (look it up in Google);
GDC '08: Final Fantasy XIII powered by Crystal Tools:
Quote: "While Final Fantasy XIII is a PlayStation 3 exclusive, Murata said Crystal Tools has no such affiliation, and is already compatible with the PC and Xbox 360 also".
So, do I really need to spell out the significance of having the SAME game engine running on both the PS3 the 360 already? ;)
The game engine is running on PC and both consoles (PS3 and 360), and therefore porting from PC to PS3 is no more difficult than from PC to 360.
So Keith, although technically they haven't started the 360 version of FFXIII yet, in practice they have started it, because the game engine is up and running on the console. So it's not as if they're starting from scratch, a vast amount of the worked needed to port the game to the 360 has ALREADY BEEN DONE.
Now if FFXIII was developed exclusively on the PS3 hardware and then the game engine and content had to be re-programmed and ported to the 360, THEN I could accept the delay argument, but I'm sure you can see now that porting to the 360 will be no more difficult than say porting an Unreal Engine 3 based game from one console (or PC) to another console.
Hence to repeat the point I made before "I doubt the 360 will add much (if anything) to delay the game further in the US and Europe. Certainly not a year, 6 months at the most given the previous FF games."
You said "I think, G4J, you are being unreasonably supportive of all things MS."
As I think you're being unreasonably anti-MS and pro-Sony here. See, I can play the same game too. :)
"I think it is only fair, at least in this, that you call a spade a spade and accept that SE could have pushed out the PS3 version out the door, if it was going to be finished earlier than the 360 version."
And I think it's only fair you look at the release dates of previous FF games before jumping to conclusions.
"Porting doesn't take place in a jiffy, or with a snap of the fingers as you seem to imply."
I'm fully aware that porting isn't an instant process, but developement is actually on PCs first, then ported to the PS3, and then ported to the 360.
This is made easier because the game runs on a multi-platform engine, called Crystal Tools (previously known as the White Engine).
The link will not work if I print it here, but this is from Gamespot on Febuary 23rd (look it up in Google);
GDC '08: Final Fantasy XIII powered by Crystal Tools:
Quote: "While Final Fantasy XIII is a PlayStation 3 exclusive, Murata said Crystal Tools has no such affiliation, and is already compatible with the PC and Xbox 360 also".
So, do I really need to spell out the significance of having the SAME game engine running on both the PS3 the 360 already? ;)
The game engine is running on PC and both consoles (PS3 and 360), and therefore porting from PC to PS3 is no more difficult than from PC to 360.
So Keith, although technically they haven't started the 360 version of FFXIII yet, in practice they have started it, because the game engine is up and running on the console. So it's not as if they're starting from scratch, a vast amount of the worked needed to port the game to the 360 has ALREADY BEEN DONE.
Now if FFXIII was developed exclusively on the PS3 hardware and then the game engine and content had to be re-programmed and ported to the 360, THEN I could accept the delay argument, but I'm sure you can see now that porting to the 360 will be no more difficult than say porting an Unreal Engine 3 based game from one console (or PC) to another console.
Hence to repeat the point I made before "I doubt the 360 will add much (if anything) to delay the game further in the US and Europe. Certainly not a year, 6 months at the most given the previous FF games."
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Re: Games4James - 2008-07-18 |
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» Finally Thinker
As you may see, I'm not just talking for the sake of it, or defending MS/360 just for the sake of it, there is logic and facts behind my arguments.
So just because they happen to clash with PS3 fanboys _here_ doesn't make me a MS/360 fanboy, just as my comments elsewhere clashing with 360 fanboys doesn't make me a Sony/PS3 fanboy there.
Speculation and rumours about FFXIII coming to the 360 grew when it was announced back then that the (then) PS3 exclusive will be running on a game engine which is also running on the PC and 360. Now the speculation and rumours have proven to be true.
Hence it wasn't a sudden decision of SE to bring FFXIII to the 360, this has been coming for a long time, where the multi-format game engine Crystal Tools plays a major part in making it possible. Therefore SE know what they're doing, and so I don't buy the idea that there was any backstabbing, that SE were forced or bribed by MS to port FFXIII to the 360, or that the 360 version will cause any significant delay to the PS3 version in the US/Europe.
We'll see what happens in future.
As you may see, I'm not just talking for the sake of it, or defending MS/360 just for the sake of it, there is logic and facts behind my arguments.
So just because they happen to clash with PS3 fanboys _here_ doesn't make me a MS/360 fanboy, just as my comments elsewhere clashing with 360 fanboys doesn't make me a Sony/PS3 fanboy there.
Speculation and rumours about FFXIII coming to the 360 grew when it was announced back then that the (then) PS3 exclusive will be running on a game engine which is also running on the PC and 360. Now the speculation and rumours have proven to be true.
Hence it wasn't a sudden decision of SE to bring FFXIII to the 360, this has been coming for a long time, where the multi-format game engine Crystal Tools plays a major part in making it possible. Therefore SE know what they're doing, and so I don't buy the idea that there was any backstabbing, that SE were forced or bribed by MS to port FFXIII to the 360, or that the 360 version will cause any significant delay to the PS3 version in the US/Europe.
We'll see what happens in future.
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Re: logicbomb.de - 2008-07-18 |
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» ^^^^^
Excellent post!
Very refreshing to see on QJ :)
Excellent post!
Very refreshing to see on QJ :)
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Re: Thinker - 2008-07-18 |
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» @Games4James
"I doubt the 360 will add much (if anything) to delay the game further in the US and Europe. Certainly not a year, 6 months at the most given the previous FF games."
If it's going to delay the release 6 months, common sense indicates that's a delay that works in favor of Microsoft, not in favor of Square-Enix or Sony. So WHO profits from this delay? Not SE, and certainly not Sony. So why are you so adamant about not fitting the pieces of the puzzle together?
Also, I see your point about the Crystal Tools engine. However, here's my position. I don't know which field you are in. I myself, am in the Software Development field, and let me tell you, even migrating something takes months, even if it the Source and Target systems are similar. We have planning, design, certain peripheral development that might be needed to make the port work, execution, testing and actual deployment, as far as I understand the process. All that doesn't take place as fast as you seem to think it should.
And while Crystal Tools, a software development tool itself, might be compatible with the 360 or PC or anything else out there, that DOES NOT MEAN that a Software Application for one machine created using Crystal Tools will, with a minimum effort, work on another architecture. A lot of customization still has to take place. It's like saying, "Order Management" system for Company X will run THE SAME for Company Y. I hope I was able to explain what I meant. I know it wasn't too clear - I'm not much of a trainer :) - but I hope you understood what I meant.
"So just because they happen to clash with PS3 fanboys _here_ doesn't make me a MS/360 fanboy, just as my comments elsewhere clashing with 360 fanboys doesn't make me a Sony/PS3 fanboy there."
-> And that's the thing, G4J, I have NEVER seen you clash with a 360 fanboy, however outrageous their post may be. You seem to always single out PS3-supporting posts only. As I said earlier, if you did clash with 360 fanboys and posted unbiased comments, then I apologize, BUT ONLY IF YOU ARE SPEAKING THE TRUTH.
And speculation and rumors don't mean sh1t - speculation and rumors for MGS4 have been around since way before the games came out, and they were just that. Doesn't mean they have basis to them. Just because speculation and rumor was raised either by 360 fans or by MS viral marketing or by industry insiders doesn't make it true.
And you can argue until you are blue in the face that you are using logic, but from where I'm standing, I see you ignoring the following logic:
1) What caused the SE shift?
2) Why the delay for the PS3 version?
3) MS track record of unsavory business practices - and that is established, if you claim otherwise, then you are lying. Just because they are winning using these practices doesn't make these practices right. It's like saying, just because some people do something wrong, others should follow suit just to keep up.
4) MS behaviour once they establish a monopoly.
Sure, keep convincing yourself that I'm a PS3 fanboy who has a strong pro-Sony and anti-MS stance if that makes you feel better. I know where I'm coming from, and my conscience is clear when I post something.
I hope you can say the same about yourself.
"I doubt the 360 will add much (if anything) to delay the game further in the US and Europe. Certainly not a year, 6 months at the most given the previous FF games."
If it's going to delay the release 6 months, common sense indicates that's a delay that works in favor of Microsoft, not in favor of Square-Enix or Sony. So WHO profits from this delay? Not SE, and certainly not Sony. So why are you so adamant about not fitting the pieces of the puzzle together?
Also, I see your point about the Crystal Tools engine. However, here's my position. I don't know which field you are in. I myself, am in the Software Development field, and let me tell you, even migrating something takes months, even if it the Source and Target systems are similar. We have planning, design, certain peripheral development that might be needed to make the port work, execution, testing and actual deployment, as far as I understand the process. All that doesn't take place as fast as you seem to think it should.
And while Crystal Tools, a software development tool itself, might be compatible with the 360 or PC or anything else out there, that DOES NOT MEAN that a Software Application for one machine created using Crystal Tools will, with a minimum effort, work on another architecture. A lot of customization still has to take place. It's like saying, "Order Management" system for Company X will run THE SAME for Company Y. I hope I was able to explain what I meant. I know it wasn't too clear - I'm not much of a trainer :) - but I hope you understood what I meant.
"So just because they happen to clash with PS3 fanboys _here_ doesn't make me a MS/360 fanboy, just as my comments elsewhere clashing with 360 fanboys doesn't make me a Sony/PS3 fanboy there."
-> And that's the thing, G4J, I have NEVER seen you clash with a 360 fanboy, however outrageous their post may be. You seem to always single out PS3-supporting posts only. As I said earlier, if you did clash with 360 fanboys and posted unbiased comments, then I apologize, BUT ONLY IF YOU ARE SPEAKING THE TRUTH.
And speculation and rumors don't mean sh1t - speculation and rumors for MGS4 have been around since way before the games came out, and they were just that. Doesn't mean they have basis to them. Just because speculation and rumor was raised either by 360 fans or by MS viral marketing or by industry insiders doesn't make it true.
And you can argue until you are blue in the face that you are using logic, but from where I'm standing, I see you ignoring the following logic:
1) What caused the SE shift?
2) Why the delay for the PS3 version?
3) MS track record of unsavory business practices - and that is established, if you claim otherwise, then you are lying. Just because they are winning using these practices doesn't make these practices right. It's like saying, just because some people do something wrong, others should follow suit just to keep up.
4) MS behaviour once they establish a monopoly.
Sure, keep convincing yourself that I'm a PS3 fanboy who has a strong pro-Sony and anti-MS stance if that makes you feel better. I know where I'm coming from, and my conscience is clear when I post something.
I hope you can say the same about yourself.
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Re: Games4James - 2008-07-21 |
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» Well after that post above...
...I can happily skip over this last post of yours with the knowledge that there's nothing worth reading in it, other than your usual speculation, assumptions and lack of any facts.
Therefore for a appropriate response, see my post above.
And yes my 'conscience is clear when I post something' too, however by your over sensitivity to being called a fanboy (which you are happy to call others), I seem to have stuck a nerve there, so obviously I'm far closer to the truth than you're willing to admit (perhaps even to yourself).
:)
...I can happily skip over this last post of yours with the knowledge that there's nothing worth reading in it, other than your usual speculation, assumptions and lack of any facts.
Therefore for a appropriate response, see my post above.
And yes my 'conscience is clear when I post something' too, however by your over sensitivity to being called a fanboy (which you are happy to call others), I seem to have stuck a nerve there, so obviously I'm far closer to the truth than you're willing to admit (perhaps even to yourself).
:)
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Re: Games4James - 2008-07-21 |
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» And finally (repeated)
Being biased towards a specific company or console does not make someone a fanboy Thinker, since a fanboy is a label given to someone who's support for one side is matched by their hatred for the other side.
Hence no matter how biased you feel someone is towards one console or company, by their comments or actions, they are not fanboys unless that bias results in a similar dislike for part or all of the competition.
Think about that next time before you play the fanboy card, and perhaps you will avoid being upset if that card is thrown back at you.
So to quote myself "you ARE as much a PS3/Sony fanboy as I am a MS/360 fanboy". Think about what that means in light of what I've just said, and then perhaps next time the discussion would be a little more polite all round.
Being biased towards a specific company or console does not make someone a fanboy Thinker, since a fanboy is a label given to someone who's support for one side is matched by their hatred for the other side.
Hence no matter how biased you feel someone is towards one console or company, by their comments or actions, they are not fanboys unless that bias results in a similar dislike for part or all of the competition.
Think about that next time before you play the fanboy card, and perhaps you will avoid being upset if that card is thrown back at you.
So to quote myself "you ARE as much a PS3/Sony fanboy as I am a MS/360 fanboy". Think about what that means in light of what I've just said, and then perhaps next time the discussion would be a little more polite all round.
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Re: Games4James - 2008-07-21 |
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» And finally finally Thinker
I just read through this thread again, and I think you're WAY over the top in the way you turned on me here, which I find very disappointing (hence my equally aggresive response).
Read it yourself and you'll see that I called you a hypocrite in response to your strong implication that I was a fanboy.
Calling you a hypocrite was NOT implying you are a fanboy, it was in response to the fact that you started your post by saying no-one should call YOU a fanboy, but you ended it by suggesting I'M a fanboy. That was the hypocracy I was referring to.
But after that ONE remark from me in defense (what did you expect btw?), you seem to have wound yourself up more and more with each new post, eventually responding as if I'd posted a lengthy attack against you .
So suddenly the gloves were off (as you said) and there you were giving me a really good kicking. Well thanks for nothing Thinker.
Perhaps you had a bad day, I don't know, but I do know that I didn't do you anything to justify that series of attacks from you. :(
I just read through this thread again, and I think you're WAY over the top in the way you turned on me here, which I find very disappointing (hence my equally aggresive response).
Read it yourself and you'll see that I called you a hypocrite in response to your strong implication that I was a fanboy.
Calling you a hypocrite was NOT implying you are a fanboy, it was in response to the fact that you started your post by saying no-one should call YOU a fanboy, but you ended it by suggesting I'M a fanboy. That was the hypocracy I was referring to.
But after that ONE remark from me in defense (what did you expect btw?), you seem to have wound yourself up more and more with each new post, eventually responding as if I'd posted a lengthy attack against you .
So suddenly the gloves were off (as you said) and there you were giving me a really good kicking. Well thanks for nothing Thinker.
Perhaps you had a bad day, I don't know, but I do know that I didn't do you anything to justify that series of attacks from you. :(
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Re: Thinker - 2008-07-22 |
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» @Games4James
".I can happily skip over this last post of yours with the knowledge that there's nothing worth reading in it, other than your usual speculation, assumptions and lack of any facts"
-> So you are skipping reading a post and positing knowledge about that post? tsk-tsk.
Let's see some of your statements, shall we?
- "So the US version would have been released months after Japan anyway"
- "360 port should be relatively painless"
- "So I doubt the 360 will add much (if anything) to delay the game further in the US and Europe."
- All you are using to support your argument of porting time is compatibility of game engine.
- While you were saying I was resorting to assumptions and was reaching for conclusions, I see a lot of "should be"s, "would have"s and implied possibles in most of your post. From that standpoint, your post is not much more than a load of hot air as well :).
What I said in my last post (and you saw fit to skip) is that this is a finished (or nearly finished - don't know) application using a software engine we are discussing. Not something in its initial stages. Wouldn't that mean porting a finished application is not so straightforward? What I based my argument on was that I myself am in the software field (although not games).
"And yes my 'conscience is clear when I post something' too, however by your over sensitivity to being called a fanboy (which you are happy to call others), I seem to have stuck a nerve there, so obviously I'm far closer to the truth than you're willing to admit (perhaps even to yourself)."
-> As for the rest of this, I think I have repeated myself enough times. Please read my last post in the discussion thread above.
Regards,
MTK
".I can happily skip over this last post of yours with the knowledge that there's nothing worth reading in it, other than your usual speculation, assumptions and lack of any facts"
-> So you are skipping reading a post and positing knowledge about that post? tsk-tsk.
Let's see some of your statements, shall we?
- "So the US version would have been released months after Japan anyway"
- "360 port should be relatively painless"
- "So I doubt the 360 will add much (if anything) to delay the game further in the US and Europe."
- All you are using to support your argument of porting time is compatibility of game engine.
- While you were saying I was resorting to assumptions and was reaching for conclusions, I see a lot of "should be"s, "would have"s and implied possibles in most of your post. From that standpoint, your post is not much more than a load of hot air as well :).
What I said in my last post (and you saw fit to skip) is that this is a finished (or nearly finished - don't know) application using a software engine we are discussing. Not something in its initial stages. Wouldn't that mean porting a finished application is not so straightforward? What I based my argument on was that I myself am in the software field (although not games).
"And yes my 'conscience is clear when I post something' too, however by your over sensitivity to being called a fanboy (which you are happy to call others), I seem to have stuck a nerve there, so obviously I'm far closer to the truth than you're willing to admit (perhaps even to yourself)."
-> As for the rest of this, I think I have repeated myself enough times. Please read my last post in the discussion thread above.
Regards,
MTK
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by Hekynn - 2008-07-17 |
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» Nice
Knowing MS they might make a PC port a year after the launch which will be awsome if they do :D
Knowing MS they might make a PC port a year after the launch which will be awsome if they do :D
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Re: mpcooper - 2008-07-17 |
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» ..
I doubt it because it seems they only do that to their exclusive games to screw over pc gamers but Call of Duty was cross platform (except the wii) and it was released on time. Hopefully it will all come out on time.
I doubt it because it seems they only do that to their exclusive games to screw over pc gamers but Call of Duty was cross platform (except the wii) and it was released on time. Hopefully it will all come out on time.
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by Steven777 - 2008-07-17 |
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» FFXIII
To get this out of the way, I own a Nintendo Wii and a Sony PS3, so I am a WiiS3 owner.
I personally would not have been as upset or even cared as much if a port had been made for Nintendo's console considering that final fantasy 1-6 were on Nintendo platforms. Since its on Microsoft's an american made product it just doesn't seem right. They should have at least stayed local to their Japanese fanbase, which is huge I might add, and produced the game only on Japanese made hardware.
I do have a grudge against Microsoft so that does play a little into me not wanting the blockbuster game Final Fantasy XIII coming to their console. But I have come to the conclusion that at least the game will be good and that a broader audience will be able to enjoy it.
To get this out of the way, I own a Nintendo Wii and a Sony PS3, so I am a WiiS3 owner.
I personally would not have been as upset or even cared as much if a port had been made for Nintendo's console considering that final fantasy 1-6 were on Nintendo platforms. Since its on Microsoft's an american made product it just doesn't seem right. They should have at least stayed local to their Japanese fanbase, which is huge I might add, and produced the game only on Japanese made hardware.
I do have a grudge against Microsoft so that does play a little into me not wanting the blockbuster game Final Fantasy XIII coming to their console. But I have come to the conclusion that at least the game will be good and that a broader audience will be able to enjoy it.
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Re: lavino - 2008-07-17 |
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» my guess is...
they probably had something legal tied to the japanese release which they are not gonna say out loud. M$ would give anything to let them have a bigger bite on the Japanese market share.
they probably had something legal tied to the japanese release which they are not gonna say out loud. M$ would give anything to let them have a bigger bite on the Japanese market share.
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by Clixt - 2008-07-17 |
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» FYI..
even if SE make a lot of "exclusives" for xbox, Sony is still gonna make money. why?? coz Sony owns SE by 9.5%
http://www.square-enix.com/jp/ir/e/stock/stockholder/
even if SE make a lot of "exclusives" for xbox, Sony is still gonna make money. why?? coz Sony owns SE by 9.5%
http://www.square-enix.com/jp/ir/e/stock/stockholder/
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Re: sickofitall - 2008-07-17 |
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» that's not the point
the gamers want to enjoy the SE games as well. But since SE seems to lead all of their games on the 360 first, or only on the 360, it does seem like something is going on behind the scenes.
the gamers want to enjoy the SE games as well. But since SE seems to lead all of their games on the 360 first, or only on the 360, it does seem like something is going on behind the scenes.
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by logicbomb.de - 2008-07-17 |
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» Money talk$
The end
The end
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Re: Thinker - 2008-07-17 |
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» @logicbomb
Yes it does! if MS keeps on bribing devs like this, 5-6 yrs down the line, MS will be dominant in the hardcore-gamer Console market, and then you will see what all this "talking" has done for you as a Consumer.
You think an absence of competition for MS will better your gaming experiences? Boy, are you naive! :)
Yes it does! if MS keeps on bribing devs like this, 5-6 yrs down the line, MS will be dominant in the hardcore-gamer Console market, and then you will see what all this "talking" has done for you as a Consumer.
You think an absence of competition for MS will better your gaming experiences? Boy, are you naive! :)
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Re: logicbomb.de - 2008-07-17 |
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» maybe....
maybe not.
Money Talks but not everyone listens, they may hear but don't listen... if you know what I mean.
see EA vs Take2, MS bid for Yahoo....
off topic I thinks its hilarious that every Sony VAIO PC sold has some flavor of Windows installed on it.
what does that have anything to do with anything?
probably nothing.
Maybe everything....
maybe not.
Money Talks but not everyone listens, they may hear but don't listen... if you know what I mean.
see EA vs Take2, MS bid for Yahoo....
off topic I thinks its hilarious that every Sony VAIO PC sold has some flavor of Windows installed on it.
what does that have anything to do with anything?
probably nothing.
Maybe everything....
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by death69 - 2008-07-17 |
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» sucks
only reason I bought a damn ps3 was for ff Xlll
owell I works well as a bluray player
only reason I bought a damn ps3 was for ff Xlll
owell I works well as a bluray player
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by Apeaggedon - 2008-07-17 |
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» that would be cool if
the anouncement was that $E was just fI_Ick!ng around with M$ and said "psych,we were just kidding.. its coming to ps3 exclusively,we just wanted to fu** with you guys" lol that would be AWSOME.
its the only way to redeem themselves for now...
(dreams)-it would be awsome if they had a launch event ver here at the playstation store were i live and no one showed up.. dude just sittin there with a pen for autograph's and then all of a sudden,ALLL the loyal ff ps3 fans come marching towrds the store with rockets,grenades,fully auto's,dynamite,and claymores and the midget kamakaze's and blow that mutha fu*k3r to smithereens.
haha woohoo!
the anouncement was that $E was just fI_Ick!ng around with M$ and said "psych,we were just kidding.. its coming to ps3 exclusively,we just wanted to fu** with you guys" lol that would be AWSOME.
its the only way to redeem themselves for now...
(dreams)-it would be awsome if they had a launch event ver here at the playstation store were i live and no one showed up.. dude just sittin there with a pen for autograph's and then all of a sudden,ALLL the loyal ff ps3 fans come marching towrds the store with rockets,grenades,fully auto's,dynamite,and claymores and the midget kamakaze's and blow that mutha fu*k3r to smithereens.
haha woohoo!
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by Psylink - 2008-07-17 |
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» holding back shipment
for those complaining about holding back shipment due to release on 360. GTA4 was delayed entirely due to being released on ps3. cry cry cry, thats all this site ever produces, one excuse and one gripe after another
for those complaining about holding back shipment due to release on 360. GTA4 was delayed entirely due to being released on ps3. cry cry cry, thats all this site ever produces, one excuse and one gripe after another
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by na2rul - 2008-07-17 |
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» brace yourselves
for more worthless GT comparison videos coming in near future (nods head worryingly).
for more worthless GT comparison videos coming in near future (nods head worryingly).
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by thefinalhero - 2008-07-17 |
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» For the love of god Square Enix...
No more surprises. Even a Final Fantasy VII remake at this point feels bittersweet because I can't trust them to keep it an exclusive. I'm still emotionally crippled from your first big announcement.
No more surprises. Even a Final Fantasy VII remake at this point feels bittersweet because I can't trust them to keep it an exclusive. I'm still emotionally crippled from your first big announcement.
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Re: thefinalhero - 2008-07-17 |
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» And seriously...
Could you use an adjective other than "shocking". That's an adjective of dissapointment. And I can't take any more.
Could you use an adjective other than "shocking". That's an adjective of dissapointment. And I can't take any more.
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by Triggeer - 2008-07-17 |
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» I would like to state...
Final Fantasy VII and Final Fantasy VIII were not Playstation exclusive, both also played on the computer. That means that Square-Enix needed to to deal with Microsoft to get their code base to be able to install on their operating system. Even though microsoft didn't have a console out, they still had both seven and eight. Eleven came for Microsoft Windows before it came to PS3. Only nine, ten , and twelve we're sony exclusive. This means that anyone stating that that Square-Enix is backstabbing Sony for 'also' (not only) going to the Xbox360, they never were exclusive.
This as well does not make them anymore more money grubbing than any other company, Square-enix may have even had to put it on the Xbox360 to pay off covering costs, games today take alot more money to make today, but yet the three big companies still have the lock of a $59.99 price for a game, and with all the man power that has to be put into games these days, to stay exclusive to any system as of right now would be a very poor choice.
I myself am a PS3 fanboy, I own a PS3 80GB and bought it as soon as I had the money. I have my own problems with the way microsoft does run things with their consoles, such as quickly abandoning a console. But to actually be angry that another console is getting the same game title as the system your more fond of is just sheer childish. That's just you saying, "O now that you have the game also my copy doesn't look as good anymore".
Final Fantasy VII and Final Fantasy VIII were not Playstation exclusive, both also played on the computer. That means that Square-Enix needed to to deal with Microsoft to get their code base to be able to install on their operating system. Even though microsoft didn't have a console out, they still had both seven and eight. Eleven came for Microsoft Windows before it came to PS3. Only nine, ten , and twelve we're sony exclusive. This means that anyone stating that that Square-Enix is backstabbing Sony for 'also' (not only) going to the Xbox360, they never were exclusive.
This as well does not make them anymore more money grubbing than any other company, Square-enix may have even had to put it on the Xbox360 to pay off covering costs, games today take alot more money to make today, but yet the three big companies still have the lock of a $59.99 price for a game, and with all the man power that has to be put into games these days, to stay exclusive to any system as of right now would be a very poor choice.
I myself am a PS3 fanboy, I own a PS3 80GB and bought it as soon as I had the money. I have my own problems with the way microsoft does run things with their consoles, such as quickly abandoning a console. But to actually be angry that another console is getting the same game title as the system your more fond of is just sheer childish. That's just you saying, "O now that you have the game also my copy doesn't look as good anymore".
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Re: thefinalhero - 2008-07-17 |
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» I have VII for both...
I don't care if they remake it only for PC and PS3. But seriously, I don't like how this console war is starting to look. It's less of a console war and more of Microsoft trying to monopolise the gaming industry.
I don't care if they remake it only for PC and PS3. But seriously, I don't like how this console war is starting to look. It's less of a console war and more of Microsoft trying to monopolise the gaming industry.
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by robbo16 - 2008-07-17 |
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» they would loos money if they released it on 360 in japan
there isnt many xbox 360 sold in japan so its easier to no make it for 360 there than to make it for 360 then translate it to english and sell it here where the console gap isnt as much
there isnt many xbox 360 sold in japan so its easier to no make it for 360 there than to make it for 360 then translate it to english and sell it here where the console gap isnt as much
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by Kingofdaberbz - 2008-07-17 |
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» Shame shame ps3 fanboys
At the end of the day it's all business. That's the whole purpose of this. When Bioshock was announced for ps3 I didn't see fanboys pouting and crying over that. It's over the game will be multi, get over it. I'll be enjoying this game on my 360.
At the end of the day it's all business. That's the whole purpose of this. When Bioshock was announced for ps3 I didn't see fanboys pouting and crying over that. It's over the game will be multi, get over it. I'll be enjoying this game on my 360.
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Re: thefinalhero - 2008-07-19 |
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» There's a big difference between Bioshock and Final Fantasy.
Though Bioshock is obviously a great game. Final Fantasy is a titan of a series in the video game industry. They used Final Fantasy to advertise Coca Cola in Japan. So though the loss of Bioshock as an exclusive may be unfortunate to some people. The loss of a game/series as monumental as Final Fantasy is a huge blow.
Though Bioshock is obviously a great game. Final Fantasy is a titan of a series in the video game industry. They used Final Fantasy to advertise Coca Cola in Japan. So though the loss of Bioshock as an exclusive may be unfortunate to some people. The loss of a game/series as monumental as Final Fantasy is a huge blow.
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by Binary - 2008-07-17 |
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» ..
I ant no fan boy. I Just love all consoles
I ant no fan boy. I Just love all consoles
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by Silverback - 2008-07-17 |
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» Finite Possibilities?
In the rare event that Metal Gear Solid 4 had been in fact possible on the 360, do you think Konami would piggyback on Microsoft just as SquareEnix has done?
I want to see someone honestly answer this question with facts to back their claim.
The way I see it, any game developer would hop at the chance of being viewed from both sides of the fence given the right brushing.
In the rare event that Metal Gear Solid 4 had been in fact possible on the 360, do you think Konami would piggyback on Microsoft just as SquareEnix has done?
I want to see someone honestly answer this question with facts to back their claim.
The way I see it, any game developer would hop at the chance of being viewed from both sides of the fence given the right brushing.
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by thefinalhero - 2008-07-21 |
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» If they do remake it for the PS3 and PC like the original...
They have started implementing Blu Ray drives into computers, so they can make it a Blu Ray format for the PC.
They have started implementing Blu Ray drives into computers, so they can make it a Blu Ray format for the PC.
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by sharkhunter66 - 2008-07-27 |
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» uhh no
The only reason why they switched to sony instead of nintendo because they couldnt do FF7 on the N64... they can and are going to damn well be able to create FF13 on the PS3 but they want money so they ported it to the RRODbox 360
The only reason why they switched to sony instead of nintendo because they couldnt do FF7 on the N64... they can and are going to damn well be able to create FF13 on the PS3 but they want money so they ported it to the RRODbox 360
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by Jez - 2008-07-28 |
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» sharkhunter66, nothing wrong in wanting money :-D
As raggedjimmi said 'Square go where the money is', and for the last two generations, that meant Playstation, but things are different today.
I don't believe a FF game has ever been released exclusively on the console with the smallest user base, and therefore I think Square were waiting to see what happens in the market before deciding on a 360 version. In my opinion, if Square Enix expected the PS3 to match or overtake the 360 in worldwide sales by the time FFXIII was released, then it may have remained a PS3 exclusive.
Also, it was not so much that they couldn't do FF7 on the N64, they were developing the game for Nintendo's console first, but they switched to the Playstation because CD offered about 10 times the capacity of the first N64 cartridges, which meant they could do much more with the game, and not only that, but the Playstation was to be launched a year earlier than the N64.
One last observation, reading though this thread, some people seem to think that this decision by Square was made quickly, perhaps following a bribe from Microsoft or something, but I doubt it, I believe they made this decision a long time ago, perhaps conditionally (depending on sales of both consoles).
And remember this anyone? From March 2007;
http://kotaku.com/gaming/ffxiii/rumour-ffxiii-exclusivity-up-in-the-air-246094.php
'Lastly, for Final Fantasy XIII, I can say to you that exclusiveness is under discussion'
So despite the denials from Square Enix later, PS3 exclusivity was never really set in stone. At this time, I expect they were already developing their multiple platform engine for PC and consoles, making it easier to bring FF to the 360 in future if they chose to do so (which we now know they did).
And don't rip me a new one guys, just expressing my opinion. :-P
As raggedjimmi said 'Square go where the money is', and for the last two generations, that meant Playstation, but things are different today.
I don't believe a FF game has ever been released exclusively on the console with the smallest user base, and therefore I think Square were waiting to see what happens in the market before deciding on a 360 version. In my opinion, if Square Enix expected the PS3 to match or overtake the 360 in worldwide sales by the time FFXIII was released, then it may have remained a PS3 exclusive.
Also, it was not so much that they couldn't do FF7 on the N64, they were developing the game for Nintendo's console first, but they switched to the Playstation because CD offered about 10 times the capacity of the first N64 cartridges, which meant they could do much more with the game, and not only that, but the Playstation was to be launched a year earlier than the N64.
One last observation, reading though this thread, some people seem to think that this decision by Square was made quickly, perhaps following a bribe from Microsoft or something, but I doubt it, I believe they made this decision a long time ago, perhaps conditionally (depending on sales of both consoles).
And remember this anyone? From March 2007;
http://kotaku.com/gaming/ffxiii/rumour-ffxiii-exclusivity-up-in-the-air-246094.php
'Lastly, for Final Fantasy XIII, I can say to you that exclusiveness is under discussion'
So despite the denials from Square Enix later, PS3 exclusivity was never really set in stone. At this time, I expect they were already developing their multiple platform engine for PC and consoles, making it easier to bring FF to the 360 in future if they chose to do so (which we now know they did).
And don't rip me a new one guys, just expressing my opinion. :-P
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Re: Games4James - 2008-07-31 |
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» Excellent post Jez
I agree with everything you've said. :)
And thanks for that link (I don't remember reading that before), great find.
I agree with everything you've said. :)
And thanks for that link (I don't remember reading that before), great find.
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by Jmak01 - 2008-07-30 |
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» they need to get a return on their investment
at first, i felt kind of decieved by square-enix because i thought FF13 was ps3 exclusive, and was angry. But now I know ps3 install base is over 14.5million and xbox 360 install base is over 20million (not much difference considering how many ps2's were sold... 120 million in 1st 5 years) basically, square-enix has put a lot of money and effort into this. Now i look at it from a higher perspective, it makes sense - they are virtually doubling the possible market, and thus, potential profit.
at first, i felt kind of decieved by square-enix because i thought FF13 was ps3 exclusive, and was angry. But now I know ps3 install base is over 14.5million and xbox 360 install base is over 20million (not much difference considering how many ps2's were sold... 120 million in 1st 5 years) basically, square-enix has put a lot of money and effort into this. Now i look at it from a higher perspective, it makes sense - they are virtually doubling the possible market, and thus, potential profit.
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Re: Games4James - 2008-07-31 |
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» Exactly
That's why I got irritated earlier in this topic with the claim that this was all because of MS forcing SE (by what ever means claimed) into producing a 360 version.
The fact is, Sony doesn't dominate the market as they did with the PS2 and Playstation. Back then, Square could afford to ignore the competition, but things are different today, and therefore the 360 offers millions of potential sales for FFXIII, perhaps even selling more than the PS3 version.
So Jez made a good point when he said SE were probably waiting to see what was happening with the sales of each console before making a final decision.
As you basically said, given the high cost of developing FFXIII, the 360's install base was just too large for SE to ignore. :)
That's why I got irritated earlier in this topic with the claim that this was all because of MS forcing SE (by what ever means claimed) into producing a 360 version.
The fact is, Sony doesn't dominate the market as they did with the PS2 and Playstation. Back then, Square could afford to ignore the competition, but things are different today, and therefore the 360 offers millions of potential sales for FFXIII, perhaps even selling more than the PS3 version.
So Jez made a good point when he said SE were probably waiting to see what was happening with the sales of each console before making a final decision.
As you basically said, given the high cost of developing FFXIII, the 360's install base was just too large for SE to ignore. :)
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User Favorites - November
Accessories
(615)Add-ons
(87)Applications
(176)Artwork
(81)Batteries
(18)Cheats
(63)Deals
(264)Events
(160)Firmware
(338)Flash Applications
(20)Flash games
(33)Game Demos
(34)Games
(5891)Hacks & Exploits
(442)Homebrew Applications
(4695)Homebrew Demos
(73)Homebrew Development
(891)Homebrew Emulators
(1173)Homebrew Games
(2406)Homebrew Themes
(18)How-To
(222)Humor
(51)Imports
(231)Interviews
(629)Magazines
(310)Mods
(211)MY QJ
(14)News
(7631)Off Topic
(603)On Shelves This Week
(30)Opinions & Analysis
(478)Podcasts
(25)Previews
(1669)PSP Go
(90)PSP Minis
(7)PSP Slim & Lite
(124)QJ How-To Series
(11)QuickJump QuickGuide
(18)QuickJump QuickPeek
(36)Reviews
(114)Rumors
(491)Scans
(170)Screenshots
(704)Site News
(174)UMD Movies
(180)Videos
(1729)Weekend Warrior
(71)Wi-Fi
(203)
Emulators
Amiga 500
(29)Amstrad CPC
(28)Apple II
(1)Atari
(64)BBC Micro computer
(8)Capcom Play System 1
(36)Capcom Play System 2
(42)Chip 8
(9)ColecoVision
(21)Commodore 64
(20)DosBox
(11)Gameboy & Gameboy Color
(91)Gameboy Advance
(64)HitBit
(8)HP48
(9)Intellivision
(9)J2ME
(3)Macintosh
(9)MAME
(23)MGT Sam Coupé
(7)MSX
(52)Neo Geo
(116)Nintendo 64
(128)Nintendo NES
(60)Odyssey
(1)PC-8801
(6)PC-9801
(7)PlayStation
(26)PSP
(45)ScummVM
(21)Sega Gamegear & Master System
(37)Sega Genesis Megadrive
(52)Super Nintendo SNES
(87)Tandy Color Computer/ Dragon
(1)Thomson MO5
(4)Thomson T07-70
(8)TI-92
(7)TI-99
(3)Turbo Grafx 16 & PC Engine
(54)Vectrex
(4)Virtual Boy
(0)Wonderswan
(30)X86
(1)ZX Spectrum
(10)ZX81 Sinclair
(7)
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